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U.S. sues Oracle, alleges salary and hiring discrimination

reuters.com

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Re: U.S. sues Oracle, alleges salary and hiring discrimination

#131

Post by ballsohardy »

paulddraper wrote: post #129
freditup wrote: post #123

That means we so far have: * Palantir sued for not hiring enough Asians [0] * Google sued for not turning over compensation data [1] * Oracle sued for hiring too many Asians While it's possible that discriminatory processes have happened at all these places, it seems these lawsuits can be targeted at whoever one wishes. It's always going to be possible to find data that indicates discrimination, unless companies hire…

> unless companies hire in exact quotas (which would also be discriminatory really). Ironically, that's probably the safest.

And a guaranteed way to not be competitive with firms that do not have these restrictions

Re: U.S. sues Oracle, alleges salary and hiring discrimination

#133

Post by lucisferre »

freditup wrote: post #123

That means we so far have: * Palantir sued for not hiring enough Asians [0] * Google sued for not turning over compensation data [1] * Oracle sued for hiring too many Asians While it's possible that discriminatory processes have happened at all these places, it seems these lawsuits can be targeted at whoever one wishes. It's always going to be possible to find data that indicates discrimination, unless companies hire…

Not saying that I agree with quotas as a solution to problems like discriminatory biases in hiring, but how is a quota system "discriminatory"? What race, sex or age group is discriminated against by a requirement that appropriate proportions of those demographics make up the companies employees? (Heck in most cases quotas are simply a low bar, they are not even proportional to the population demographics.)

I can understand how it perhaps seems unfair if someone is not hired purely on perceived talent alone, but they are not being discriminated against. That's not the right word for that.

Re: U.S. sues Oracle, alleges salary and hiring discrimination

#134

Post by lawnchair_larry »

1_2__3 wrote: post #85
gozur88 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And also not believable. The idea Oracle had a system that paid white guys more because they were white guys isn't credible without more than just salary evidence.

You act like the DOJ is just shooting from the hip here. Yes, it's believable, because the DOJ said under penalty of perjury in a federal court that it's happening. Hand-wavey "not believable" replies are ridiculous.

That isn't how DOJ charges work.

Re: U.S. sues Oracle, alleges salary and hiring discrimination

#135

Post by wang_li »

_m8fo wrote: post #15

Couple points: First, this is where the meat is: https://www.dol.gov/newsroom/releases/ofccp/ofccp20170118-0 Second: "...Oracle nevertheless preferred Asian applications over other qualified applicants in the Professional Technical 1, Individual Contributor Job group and in the Product Development job group at statistically significant rates." [1] [1] https://www.dol.gov/sites/default/files/newsroom/newsrelease... --…

There are plenty of affirmative action organizations that would be very upset with anonymization of applicants.

Re: U.S. sues Oracle, alleges salary and hiring discrimination

#136

Post by SamUK96 »

blazespin wrote: post #130
freditup wrote: post #123

That means we so far have: * Palantir sued for not hiring enough Asians [0] * Google sued for not turning over compensation data [1] * Oracle sued for hiring too many Asians While it's possible that discriminatory processes have happened at all these places, it seems these lawsuits can be targeted at whoever one wishes. It's always going to be possible to find data that indicates discrimination, unless companies hire…

Lol, please. "Exact quotas". Gimme a break. There are no exact quotas here. These companies have just gone overboard and getting their hands slapped. But, by all means, MAGA. Let's go back to the time when no XXXX are allowed on my watch.

Rather daft comment.

And these companies haven't "gone crazy". There is zero evidence for that.

Also, exact quotas is discriminatory by definition. You are, by definition, hiring and/or not hiring somebody because of their race, which itself is becoming a rather tenuous concept in itself due to globalisation (mixing of races).

Re: U.S. sues Oracle, alleges salary and hiring discrimination

#137

Post by mschuster91 »

hueving wrote: post #69
bubbleRefuge wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, I can tell the way sentences are formed in many cases if I'm dealing with a native speaker or not.

Would you kindly do the willingly and explain how? :)

It's pretty easy, but also pretty rough - if you're good, you can certainly distinguish between an American, a British or an Indian English-speaking person writing.

Re: U.S. sues Oracle, alleges salary and hiring discrimination

#138

Post by SamUK96 »

blazespin wrote: post #130
freditup wrote: post #123

That means we so far have: * Palantir sued for not hiring enough Asians [0] * Google sued for not turning over compensation data [1] * Oracle sued for hiring too many Asians While it's possible that discriminatory processes have happened at all these places, it seems these lawsuits can be targeted at whoever one wishes. It's always going to be possible to find data that indicates discrimination, unless companies hire…

Lol, please. "Exact quotas". Gimme a break. There are no exact quotas here. These companies have just gone overboard and getting their hands slapped. But, by all means, MAGA. Let's go back to the time when no XXXX are allowed on my watch.

Rather daft comment.

These companies haven't "gone crazy". There is zero evidence for that.

Also, exact quotas is discriminatory by definition. You are, again by definition, hiring and/or not hiring somebody because of their race. Even then, race is becoming a rather tenuous concept in itself due to globalisation (mixing of races).

Re: U.S. sues Oracle, alleges salary and hiring discrimination

#139

Post by maxxxxx »

lucisferre wrote: post #133
freditup wrote: post #123

That means we so far have: * Palantir sued for not hiring enough Asians [0] * Google sued for not turning over compensation data [1] * Oracle sued for hiring too many Asians While it's possible that discriminatory processes have happened at all these places, it seems these lawsuits can be targeted at whoever one wishes. It's always going to be possible to find data that indicates discrimination, unless companies hire…

Not saying that I agree with quotas as a solution to problems like discriminatory biases in hiring, but how is a quota system "discriminatory"? What race, sex or age group is discriminated against by a requirement that appropriate proportions of those demographics make up the companies employees? (Heck in most cases quotas are simply a low bar, they are not even proportional to the population demographics.) I can und…

Sure people with the right skills are being discriminated against if they aren't in one of the favored groups. There is also no quota for white people or men. In my company these groups seem pretty underrepresented in some departments. Maybe they should do blind tests like government often does.

Re: U.S. sues Oracle, alleges salary and hiring discrimination

#140

Post by blazespin »

SamUK96 wrote: post #136
blazespin wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lol, please. "Exact quotas". Gimme a break. There are no exact quotas here. These companies have just gone overboard and getting their hands slapped. But, by all means, MAGA. Let's go back to the time when no XXXX are allowed on my watch.

Rather daft comment. And these companies haven't "gone crazy". There is zero evidence for that. Also, exact quotas is discriminatory by definition . You are, by definition, hiring and/or not hiring somebody because of their race, which itself is becoming a rather tenuous concept in itself due to globalisation (mixing of races).

Without these sorts of rules than it's a free for all. I have zero evidence except life experience to say that if people could hire their preferred tribe, they would. The homogeneous work culture alone would probably be very effective. But wow, what a horrendous world to live in. I mean, seriously, you kids have no idea.
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