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Obama Commutes Bulk of Chelsea Manning’s Sentence

nytimes.com

191–200 of 797 posts

Re: Obama Commutes Bulk of Chelsea Manning’s Sentence

#191

Commuting Manning's sentence without pardoning Snowden feels like politics to me. Manning's actions embarrassed the Bush administration so Obama will commute. Snowden's actions embarrassed the Obama administration so Obama won't pardon.

Obama has said that the two cases are different in that Manning has gone through the legal system, sentenced, and serving time, whereas Snowden is in a country that doesn't have an extradition treaty with the US and hasn't been tried under the US legal system.

Re: Obama Commutes Bulk of Chelsea Manning’s Sentence

#192
post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"How could they not punish Manning?" But she was punished. With 7 years that she already spent in jail. I don't think that reducing her sentence from 35 years to 7 years "encourage others to leak".

The book, "The Spy Who Couldn't Spell: A Dyslexic Traitor, an Unbreakable Code, and the FBI's Hunt for America's Stolen Secrets" by Yudhijit Bhattacharjee tells the story of an American intelligence worker who tried to pass off information to other governments just prior to Sept. 11th. His motivation was money (selling his secrets for millions of dollars) and when he was caught, he was hoping to have his sentence red…

Different circumstances. Spying for money should be treated radically differently than spying for conscience.

Re: Obama Commutes Bulk of Chelsea Manning’s Sentence

#193

Seven years is still a long time for whistle blowing. I'm glad to see she is still getting released though. It's important to note commuting the sentence is not a pardon. Chelsea will still have this conviction for the rest of her life. I know there is a lot of controversy with Manning compared to Wikileaks et. al. as far as not redacting documents or using a discriminating news source to filter them. Still, I oppose…

I have mixed feelings on this. Manning did commit a crime. They were entrusted with classified information and they released it on purpose. For all of the corruption and wrongdoing the release of those cables uncovered, didn't it also do things like give away the positions of some undercover agents? And harm US diplomatic relations with other countries? Look at it from the POV of the government: How could they not pu…

There really wasn't much in the way of corruption and wrongdoing in the diplomatic cables. If anything they showed that the mundane private details of US diplomacy match US public diplomatic stances quite closely.

Re: Obama Commutes Bulk of Chelsea Manning’s Sentence

#194
post #131

Off-topic but.. "they"? Manning isn't a group of people. Just say "she", it's really easy.

Sorry. I didn't know which pronoun to use because I didn't know if gender changes apply retroactively, grammatically speaking. I'm having trouble knowing which one to use to write this post, too. At the time of the leaks Chelsea Manning identified as Bradley, a male. Is it politically correct to use 'she' for all past references, including the times where Chelsea Manning identified as male? Or would it make more sense to use 'he' when Chelsea Manning identified as male, and 'she' when Chelsea Manning identifies as female?

Re: Obama Commutes Bulk of Chelsea Manning’s Sentence

#195

She. Not they. Chelsea Manning identifies as female.

Sorry. I didn't know which pronoun to use because I didn't know if gender changes apply retroactively, grammatically speaking. I'm having trouble knowing which one to use to write this post, too. At the time of the leaks Chelsea Manning identified as Bradley, a male. Is it politically correct to use 'she' for all past references, including the times where Chelsea Manning identified as male? Or would it make more sens…

Very understandable. I believe pronouns apply retroactively.

Re: Obama Commutes Bulk of Chelsea Manning’s Sentence

#196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This has been discussed before. A President can pardon people for crimes they may be charged with in the future.

Yes, but politically, "we dropped her sentence to seven years in jail" is more tenable than "we pardoned someone who never stood trial nor served a day in jail".

Valid point. The possibility is real, but the difficulty you highlighted may make it less likely.

Not that there is no precedent of course (Nixon).

Re: Obama Commutes Bulk of Chelsea Manning’s Sentence

#198
post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Or it's Obama recognizing that someone with mental health issues the military is ill-equipped to address who has been in custody for seven years has been punished enough." Playing Devil's Advocate: if this is the case, why did it take until the last week of his tenure as President for him to do this? No, this smells of "legacy". Obama could have done this years ago.

It's not atypical for a president to wait until the end of their term to issue pardons and commutations, for legacy, or any other consideration.

That's true.

However, if the supposed motivation is because somebody is suffering...why wait another day, another week, another month, another year?

If this took place before the election, you could call it a principled decision.

If this took place immediately after the election, you could call it a cautious-but-nevertheless-sound decision that might have otherwise been passed on to a (presumably friendly) successor.

Instead, this has taken place three days before he leaves office.

Manning hasn't gone anywhere in seven years. This was not based on a long bout of soul-searching or a sudden new development.

This was a move to either bolster Obama's legacy, or grease the wheels for a post-Presidential opportunity.

Re: Obama Commutes Bulk of Chelsea Manning’s Sentence

#199

Seven years is still a long time for whistle blowing. I'm glad to see she is still getting released though. It's important to note commuting the sentence is not a pardon. Chelsea will still have this conviction for the rest of her life. I know there is a lot of controversy with Manning compared to Wikileaks et. al. as far as not redacting documents or using a discriminating news source to filter them. Still, I oppose…

I have mixed feelings on this. Manning did commit a crime. They were entrusted with classified information and they released it on purpose. For all of the corruption and wrongdoing the release of those cables uncovered, didn't it also do things like give away the positions of some undercover agents? And harm US diplomatic relations with other countries? Look at it from the POV of the government: How could they not pu…

According to this article, the prosecution failed to provide evidence that anyone was killed due to the leaks. I don't know if anyone was harmed, but it really doesn't seem like it.

Re: Obama Commutes Bulk of Chelsea Manning’s Sentence

#200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While he isn't blameless, the ACA helped a lot of people, the economy recovered greatly (admittedly all he had to do was not fuck it up), permitted states to legalize weed. For me I have to say the ACA is probably the biggest reason why I liked him well enough. I was able to stay on my parents insurance until I was 26, and then since I was self-employed I was able to easily get insurance through the marketplace. Now…

There as been more marijuana prosecution under Obama than under Bush. The idea they have been less hostile is a myth. States have simply been doing better at fighting back. http://www.theweek.co.uk/crime/47303/why-barack-obamas-marij...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/marijuana-arrests-2014_u... very much contradicts your assertion (which isn't backed up anywhere in the article you cite, either).

> At the same time, arrests for the sale and manufacture of marijuana also continued to decrease in 2014. These arrests reached an all-time high of 103,247 in 2010, but they’ve since been falling, reaching a nearly 20-year low of 81,184 last year.

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