Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Obama bemoans 'diversions' of IPod, Xbox era

google.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 73 posts

Re: Obama bemoans 'diversions' of IPod, Xbox era

#21

Post by sachinag »

hugh3 wrote: post #11
tel wrote: post #5

It seems his argument is that information inundation lets stupid ideas live longer than they might otherwise, which is actually pretty wise. It's not necessary to pin it on iPods and XBoxes, but the idea that we need to learn healthy ways to survive information bombardment is neither new nor unwieldy. The historical comparisons are interesting, but I suppose it's one of those questions where technology is available b…

It seems his argument is that information inundation lets stupid ideas live longer than they might otherwise, which is actually pretty wise I'm not convinced that Obama can distinguish between "stupid ideas" and "ideas which are contrary to the Obama agenda" though. Of course he's hardly unique among politicians for this, but I do think he's less likely than, say, President Bush, to acknowledge the existence of infor…

The birther stuff, in particular, is a great example of nonsense that perpetuates. On a policy level, we were hijacked by the death panel nonsense. Debate the public option and minimum coverage requirements and subsidies - sure - but the death panel stuff is just nonsense designed purely to distort the debate.

If you don't get how having to deal with stuff like that at the expense of substantive debate harms our nation, I don't know what to tell you.

Why their communications team (and remember his chief speechwriter since 2007 is a guy born in 1981[1]) keeps linking this with video games and iPods (which he certainly does know how to use; it's a bizarre line) has to be some sort of polling data. Cause, on its face, it's asinine.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Favreau_(speechwriter)

Re: Obama bemoans 'diversions' of IPod, Xbox era

#22

Post by davidhperry »

indrax wrote: post #18

>"With iPods and iPads and Xboxes and PlayStations, -- none of which I know how to work..." What the hell? This sounds like Bush. What happened to the guy who was in love with his blackberry?

My guess is that he's feigning some ignorance in order to identify with 'regular folks.'

Re: Obama bemoans 'diversions' of IPod, Xbox era

#23

Post by marilyn »

Obama's arguments here remind me of Noam Chomsky's thoughts on sports:

Sports keeps people from worrying about things that matter to their lives that they might have some idea of doing something about. And in fact it’s striking to see the intelligence that’s used by ordinary people in sports [as opposed to political and social issues].

So much chatter to distract us from the important issues of the day.

Re: Obama bemoans 'diversions' of IPod, Xbox era

#24

Post by TriinT »

hammerdr wrote: post #13

This makes me sad. Despite my political opposition to Obama, I thought that he understood the culture of the "IPod, XBox era." In fact, he leveraged these tools of 'diversion' in his campaign (and did so very effectively). This seems to be the knee-jerk technophobic speech that politicians would have given in the latter half of the 20th Century. Instead of being afraid and resistant to technology (which, as we have s…

Sorry, but your argument is nonsensical. I may disagree with Obama on some political issues, but I entirely agree with his point. He's not attacking technology, he's attacking complacency and indolence. Hence, technophobic is not the word to use to describe his speech.

Technology, per se, is neutral. In an era of information overload, when the ability to focus has almost become a luxury, it seems plausible to think of the iPod and the Xbox as unnecessary distractions that cause more harm than good. The U.S. is fighting two (virtually) unwinnable wars and, yet, the masses seem to be more concerned with trivialities such as Tiger Woods' philandering, celebrity gossip, Steve Jobs health status, etc etc etc. Time is scarce, and time spent on sending text messages to friends on your iPhone, or on killing virtual aliens on Xbox is time that is not being spent on education. The media have become a circus, trading education for easy entertainment. "Books" from dimwits like Gladwell become best-sellers. Civil liberties are stolen from us, and yet we're too busy with Facebook to pay attention to it. We have become "soft" and docile, and we have forgotten that "the price to pay for tranquility is eternal vigilance" (paraphrasing Jefferson), that liberty and prosperity are not birth-rights but rather something one fights for constantly.

Re: Obama bemoans 'diversions' of IPod, Xbox era

#25

Post by thaumaturgy »

hammerdr wrote: post #13

This makes me sad. Despite my political opposition to Obama, I thought that he understood the culture of the "IPod, XBox era." In fact, he leveraged these tools of 'diversion' in his campaign (and did so very effectively). This seems to be the knee-jerk technophobic speech that politicians would have given in the latter half of the 20th Century. Instead of being afraid and resistant to technology (which, as we have s…

I'm unsurprised that the readers here latched right on to the tools mentioned in the article, and entirely missed the point of his statements:

> ...politicians should be encouraging the public to put these technological advances to good use.

This is exactly his point. He used a few devices to hi-lite the difference between information-as-entertainment, and information-as-a-tool. This in no way makes him hypocritical for being constantly connected to a Blackberry; he's using the device in exactly the way that he's urging young graduates to use going forward. (It may make him a little hypocritical for his campaign machine, though.)

I think he's right. I think he's being proven right all the time by sites like Reddit, which were supposed to democratize the news, except that instead they repeatedly become a megaphone for internet tough guy squads and get hyped over issues where they don't have all the facts. Or like HackerNews, where daring to mention some high-tech devices causes everyone to completely miss the actual point of an argument.

Re: Obama bemoans 'diversions' of IPod, Xbox era

#26

Post by hugh3 »

sachinag wrote: post #21
hugh3 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems his argument is that information inundation lets stupid ideas live longer than they might otherwise, which is actually pretty wise I'm not convinced that Obama can distinguish between "stupid ideas" and "ideas which are contrary to the Obama agenda" though. Of course he's hardly unique among politicians for this, but I do think he's less likely than, say, President Bush, to acknowledge the existence of infor…

The birther stuff, in particular, is a great example of nonsense that perpetuates. On a policy level, we were hijacked by the death panel nonsense. Debate the public option and minimum coverage requirements and subsidies - sure - but the death panel stuff is just nonsense designed purely to distort the debate. If you don't get how having to deal with stuff like that at the expense of substantive debate harms our nati…

Actually I kinda think stupid ideas like birtherism are deliberately given air by the Obama operation. I don't mean that in a "conspiracy theory" sense, I just mean that politicians would rather engage loudly with the silliest of their opponents rather than the most sensible. By focusing attention on the few loonies who oppose Obama, Obama attempts to associate opposition to Obama with looniness. If birthers didn't exist, it would be necessary to invent them.

As evidence, witness how quickly and reflexively this thread jumped into a discussion of birtherism.

Anyway, I guess my point is that would be hypocritical for Obama (or, in all fairness, pretty much any politician out there) to complain about the infantilization of political rhetoric. This, after all, is the man whose favourite rhetorical device is the "There are those who say [something that nobody actually says]" strawman.

Re: Obama bemoans 'diversions' of IPod, Xbox era

#27

Post by hammerdr »

silentOpen wrote: post #20
hammerdr wrote: post #13

This makes me sad. Despite my political opposition to Obama, I thought that he understood the culture of the "IPod, XBox era." In fact, he leveraged these tools of 'diversion' in his campaign (and did so very effectively). This seems to be the knee-jerk technophobic speech that politicians would have given in the latter half of the 20th Century. Instead of being afraid and resistant to technology (which, as we have s…

He's not placing the blame on the tools any more than you or I would bemoan the hours 'lost' to Hacker News. It's a longer view, step back. We do need to come to grips with the social changes that are occurring and the implications of our present and future digital lives. Our man-made environment isn't the problem, it's our evolutionary memory combined with the phenomenal acceleration of information technology.

I disagree because of this one line in his speech:

"none of which I know how to work"

which reads like the classic politician's way of distancing him- or herself from the technology (and have heard from technophobic politicians--http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/06/11/mccain-admits-he-do...). Whether its true or not isn't really the point (do we seriously believe Obama wouldn't know what to do with a iPad, iPhone or iPod?), the point is that it was in his speech. I could be completely off base here (and I surely hope that I am!), but this is a decidedly late 20th century speech in my interpretation.

Re: Obama bemoans 'diversions' of IPod, Xbox era

#28

Post by AKSHAYUDAYBHAT »

hammerdr wrote: post #13

This makes me sad. Despite my political opposition to Obama, I thought that he understood the culture of the "IPod, XBox era." In fact, he leveraged these tools of 'diversion' in his campaign (and did so very effectively). This seems to be the knee-jerk technophobic speech that politicians would have given in the latter half of the 20th Century. Instead of being afraid and resistant to technology (which, as we have s…

IPAD/XBOX arent about information but about content they are about wasting time watching videos and playing games. And not about creating content, ppl on this forum have lost their minds. IPad is walled garden where papa Steve wants you to spend all your bucks on frivolity. Plz dont mistake it for information revolution or anything.

Re: Obama bemoans 'diversions' of IPod, Xbox era

#29

Post by hugh3 »

davidhperry wrote: post #22
indrax wrote: post #18

>"With iPods and iPads and Xboxes and PlayStations, -- none of which I know how to work..." What the hell? This sounds like Bush. What happened to the guy who was in love with his blackberry?

My guess is that he's feigning some ignorance in order to identify with 'regular folks.'

Really? It sounds to me more like the classic snobbery routine of pretending not to understand the things liked by the masses.

I, for instance, am still pretending not to know who Justin Bieber is.

Re: Obama bemoans 'diversions' of IPod, Xbox era

#30

Post by [deleted] »

ErrantX wrote: post #12

Excellent; that's some of the most intelligent argument in this area I've seen for a while. And it is so true. Look st how much time people spend propogating meme's on facebook. Ok so there is always room for us to enjoy banal stuff - but I feel like it is starting to enroach on our lives. It's like the sivers post from the other day; if only we shared an interesting wikipedia rather than one of those chain emails, c…

[deleted]
Post reply on HN