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I’m Joining LinkedIn

tomdale.net

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Re: I’m Joining LinkedIn

#51

Post by kethinov »

> Perhaps you can write a tiny web app that loads instantly and still retains a full set of features, but most of the world cannot.

I've long been skeptical of this line of thinking emanating from major thick client JS framework authors. I think they underestimate what people are capable of.

> Over time, Ember will become like gcc -O3 for web apps, intelligently optimizing them and delivering them as fast as possible, piece by piece, to your user’s browser.

I've been observing these trends for years and what I'm seeing is this: ever since these new thick client JS frameworks became so trendy, web performance has dramatically decreased, not increased.

This one-two combo punch of framework authors condescending their users as "our target audience is devs who can't hand code" while simultaneously promising performance that's just as good as hand coding and perpetually failing to deliver is a toxic stew that is crippling web performance.

Re: I’m Joining LinkedIn

#52

Post by [deleted] »

blub wrote: post #48
tyingq wrote: post #13

Lots of flagged comments, I suppose because of short quips related to the sleazy things LinkedIn has done in the past. I'm sure he's not unaware of those things. I wonder if he's thinking he may be able to influence them? Discourage dark patterns? Discourage the current mobile experience that's broken unless you download the app and/or log in?

LinkedIn's behavior is driven by profit. They want advertising money and are willing to sacrifice their users for that, just like Google, Facebook and more recently Microsoft, which happens to own LinkedIn. This person probably just wants to work on interesting things (for them) and get paid well, just like the thousands of employees at the other companies I mentioned. Fighting for ethical software doesn't pay. Nor d…

[deleted]

Re: I’m Joining LinkedIn

#53

Post by mnutt »

WhitneyLand wrote: post #22

Is this concerning? https://www.google.com/trends/explore?q=ember.js,react.js In any case congrats on the new gig Tom.

I think a more accurate comparison is this: https://www.google.com/trends/explore?q=ember%20javascript,r...

Regardless, I've bet on Ember both at my company and personally because I think they've done a lot of things right and their community process sets them up to continue on that track. As long as the community and innovation continues, I don't think it matters if React keyword searches are 20x Ember's.

Re: I’m Joining LinkedIn

#54

Post by tyingq »

blub wrote: post #48
tyingq wrote: post #13

Lots of flagged comments, I suppose because of short quips related to the sleazy things LinkedIn has done in the past. I'm sure he's not unaware of those things. I wonder if he's thinking he may be able to influence them? Discourage dark patterns? Discourage the current mobile experience that's broken unless you download the app and/or log in?

LinkedIn's behavior is driven by profit. They want advertising money and are willing to sacrifice their users for that, just like Google, Facebook and more recently Microsoft, which happens to own LinkedIn. This person probably just wants to work on interesting things (for them) and get paid well, just like the thousands of employees at the other companies I mentioned. Fighting for ethical software doesn't pay. Nor d…

I think there is a line where it makes sense to speak up. Short term revenue isn't always worth the long term reputation hit.

Re: I’m Joining LinkedIn

#55

Post by lomnakkus »

WillEngler wrote: post #49
lomnakkus wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some leeway could me made around that statement. What do you mean? Who needs the leeway? (I suspect "artisanal, shade-grown code" just means "bad", but perhaps stated in a more PR-friendly way.) > People who work in fishing and agricultural[...] What are you talking about? I've known several people who work in fishing (fish farming, specifically), and I can assure you that they weren't particularly concerned about…

I thought "artisanal, shade-grown code" was such a delightful phrase. I took it to mean not bad, but rather too costly for practical/mass use. Like some people can afford to buy $6 lattes, and those are likely very tasty lattes, but Folgers is going to move more beans.

It's an amazing phrase. AFAICT it doesn't actually mean anything. I certainly understand why such a high-profile developer would choose such a "bland, yet poetic" phrasing; my issue is just with trying to interpret it as somehow insightful.

Re: I’m Joining LinkedIn

#56

Post by sekou »

lomnakkus wrote: post #44
sekou wrote: post #38

> artisanal, shade-grown code doesn’t scale to large engineering organizations Some leeway could me made around that statement. People who work in fishing and agricultural industries for example could benefit from unique and specially crafted services when it comes to job search and fulfillment. There is a certain effectiveness in the one-size-fits-all approach of applications like Facebook but it could stand to exis…

> Some leeway could me made around that statement. What do you mean? Who needs the leeway? (I suspect "artisanal, shade-grown code" just means "bad", but perhaps stated in a more PR-friendly way.) > People who work in fishing and agricultural[...] What are you talking about? I've known several people who work in fishing (fish farming, specifically), and I can assure you that they weren't particularly concerned about…

I don't know how technology can best help people in different places make money and find the work they want. I think the author is saying that economies of scale helps bigger companies deliver better products and services, but I think moving forward on the other end by enabling the development of specialized software can also be beneficial. In fact by continuing to work on Ember I think the author is actually doing this.

Re: I’m Joining LinkedIn

#57

Post by wstrange »

wmil wrote: post #42
tyingq wrote: post #13

Lots of flagged comments, I suppose because of short quips related to the sleazy things LinkedIn has done in the past. I'm sure he's not unaware of those things. I wonder if he's thinking he may be able to influence them? Discourage dark patterns? Discourage the current mobile experience that's broken unless you download the app and/or log in?

He's probably thinking that past sleazy behavior was driven by a need for revenue. The Microsoft purchase changes that. MS needs to protect it's reputation more than it needs revenue from Linkedin.

Microsoft paid 26 Billion for Linkedin. I'm pretty sure they expect to extract revenue out of them.

Re: I’m Joining LinkedIn

#58

Post by sekou »

WillEngler wrote: post #49
lomnakkus wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some leeway could me made around that statement. What do you mean? Who needs the leeway? (I suspect "artisanal, shade-grown code" just means "bad", but perhaps stated in a more PR-friendly way.) > People who work in fishing and agricultural[...] What are you talking about? I've known several people who work in fishing (fish farming, specifically), and I can assure you that they weren't particularly concerned about…

I thought "artisanal, shade-grown code" was such a delightful phrase. I took it to mean not bad, but rather too costly for practical/mass use. Like some people can afford to buy $6 lattes, and those are likely very tasty lattes, but Folgers is going to move more beans.

This is what I took it to mean. It wouldn't be horrible if Starbucks was the only option for coffee, but take away all the small cafes and you miss out on a lot. There may be some trouble with that analogy but the idea is there's value in specialization.

Re: I’m Joining LinkedIn

#59

Post by lomnakkus »

sekou wrote: post #56
lomnakkus wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some leeway could me made around that statement. What do you mean? Who needs the leeway? (I suspect "artisanal, shade-grown code" just means "bad", but perhaps stated in a more PR-friendly way.) > People who work in fishing and agricultural[...] What are you talking about? I've known several people who work in fishing (fish farming, specifically), and I can assure you that they weren't particularly concerned about…

I don't know how technology can best help people in different places make money and find the work they want. I think the author is saying that economies of scale helps bigger companies deliver better products and services, but I think moving forward on the other end by enabling the development of specialized software can also be beneficial. In fact by continuing to work on Ember I think the author is actually doing t…

So what were you doing with that whole "fishing" bit?

(I mean, I don't necessarily disagree with your position, I just don't think you should try to support it with entirely fictitious examples.)

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