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Live display of CO2 emitted to produce electricity in European countries

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Re: Live display of CO2 emitted to produce electricity in European countries

#151

Post by lobster_johnson »

hnusername wrote: post #134
mixedbit wrote: post #115

Polish right-wing government is blocking any development that could hurt coal industry. They passed the law that significantly constrains where windmills can be located. They also hindered development of solar by reverting the law that allowed individual owners of solar panels to be paid for the overproduced electricity.

Polish government is not right-wing. There may be right wing of it, but it is not right wing per se. Right wing of what? See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanation for a better clue about what current polish government may aspire to be like. It may have some right wing parts of what is above all big centrist coalition. Another issue is. How is this government blocking development that could hurt coal industry any dif…

The gradient goes from green to black. Black represents a carbon intensity of 700 gCO2/kWH. If you want Poland to be green, Poland has to consume less carbon.

As Polish government being right-wing: Since it's a coalition of two parties, it would be wrong to call the entire government right-wing. But the Law and Justice party certainly is.

Re: Live display of CO2 emitted to produce electricity in European countries

#152

Post by greglindahl »

melling wrote: post #138
jonathansizz wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to the US Fish & Wildlife service, wind turbine deaths are tiny compared with many other human causes. https://www.fws.gov/birds/bird-enthusiasts/threats-to-birds....

Currently there aren't that many wind turbines. I imagine the proposal is to have at least 100x the number to replace all of the fossil fuels. Imagine the planet covered with wind turbines.

If you look at the chart in the link, 100x-ing wind turbines, if it was linear, would still be a tiny number of bird deaths compared to other sources.

Re: Live display of CO2 emitted to produce electricity in European countries

#153

Post by logicallee »

notsoeasy wrote: post #40
_ph_ wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, if you read those conversations, you might notice that people think that - nuclear is very expensive - nuclear has a waste and risk problem - wind and solar are price competitive and very environment friendly

> nuclear is very expensive If you disagree, and have an argument, why are you not providing it? > nuclear has a waste and risk problem Yes, and? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-level_radioactive_waste_m... > Thus, Alfvén identified two fundamental prerequisites for effective management of high-level radioactive waste: (1) stable geological formations, and (2) stable human institutions over hundreds of thousands o…

it's so bizarre that you think _ph_ disagrees with these arguments. their parent comment likes nuclear but says it unfortunately always loses in HN discussions, and_ph_ summarizes why it loses.

I clicked your HN profile which says " Defend yourself. Your mindless, entitled pouting makes me aggressive. As it should."

HN is a place to be civil. it's in the rules. That's why it's better than other places. Please, improve your attitude here and don't have that profile text. If you do, you'll (rightly) be shadow banned for those toxic "contributions" and then you won't derail threads with gratuitous negativity.

Rather than lash out against someone who you completely agree with, you could have just written your comment to read "To elaborate on these points..." and then given your helpful information.

then you would have been upvoted. In the future please be more constructive :). and welcome to HN.

Re: Live display of CO2 emitted to produce electricity in European countries

#154

Post by hnusername »

lobster_johnson wrote: post #151
hnusername wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Polish government is not right-wing. There may be right wing of it, but it is not right wing per se. Right wing of what? See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanation for a better clue about what current polish government may aspire to be like. It may have some right wing parts of what is above all big centrist coalition. Another issue is. How is this government blocking development that could hurt coal industry any dif…

The gradient goes from green to black. Black represents a carbon intensity of 700 gCO2/kWH. If you want Poland to be green, Poland has to consume less carbon. As Polish government being right-wing: Since it's a coalition of two parties, it would be wrong to call the entire government right-wing. But the Law and Justice party certainly is.

> Poland has to consume less carbon.

I thought it was about emitting CO2. If it is about consuming carbon (coal), then we would take black badge for being leader in coal consumption in Europe. Black is ok then. But we are not even a leader in coal consumption.

Colors are just colors, but it seems as if black here suggests pollution (opposite to green on the scale). CO2 does not qualify as a pollutant that easily as NO2, S02 or NH3 for that matter. If anything it should be more on the green end of the scale. But it would make the scale seem nonsensical in that context. Wouldn't it ?

Anyway. I don't buy it.

Re: Live display of CO2 emitted to produce electricity in European countries

#155

Post by avar »

sgift wrote: post #73
witty_username wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But can you enter containment?

Yes, you can. The only area we didn't visit when I toured Isar 2 was the control room (we looked through the window and got a description of the various parts and their function).

How did you arrange this? Is this something you just sign up, or do you call them and assure them you're enthusiastic about nuclear energy and eventually they relent?

Re: Live display of CO2 emitted to produce electricity in European countries

#156

Post by lobster_johnson »

hnusername wrote: post #154
lobster_johnson wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The gradient goes from green to black. Black represents a carbon intensity of 700 gCO2/kWH. If you want Poland to be green, Poland has to consume less carbon. As Polish government being right-wing: Since it's a coalition of two parties, it would be wrong to call the entire government right-wing. But the Law and Justice party certainly is.

> Poland has to consume less carbon. I thought it was about emitting CO2. If it is about consuming carbon (coal), then we would take black badge for being leader in coal consumption in Europe. Black is ok then. But we are not even a leader in coal consumption. Colors are just colors, but it seems as if black here suggests pollution (opposite to green on the scale). CO2 does not qualify as a pollutant that easily as N…

The colours do represent CO2 emissions. But Poland wouldn't emit so much if it weren't also consuming that much.

(To be fair, it looks like it's exporting a little bit. That doesn't help, since it's nearly all fossil.)

Re: Live display of CO2 emitted to produce electricity in European countries

#157

Post by primitivesuave »

hnusername wrote: post #134
mixedbit wrote: post #115

Polish right-wing government is blocking any development that could hurt coal industry. They passed the law that significantly constrains where windmills can be located. They also hindered development of solar by reverting the law that allowed individual owners of solar panels to be paid for the overproduced electricity.

Polish government is not right-wing. There may be right wing of it, but it is not right wing per se. Right wing of what? See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanation for a better clue about what current polish government may aspire to be like. It may have some right wing parts of what is above all big centrist coalition. Another issue is. How is this government blocking development that could hurt coal industry any dif…

Didn't your government effectively take away all powers from the top constitutional court, allowing the government to pass any law without judicial backlash? Meanwhile you are all hung up on what the color green represents.

Re: Live display of CO2 emitted to produce electricity in European countries

#158

Post by melling »

greglindahl wrote: post #152
melling wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Currently there aren't that many wind turbines. I imagine the proposal is to have at least 100x the number to replace all of the fossil fuels. Imagine the planet covered with wind turbines.

If you look at the chart in the link, 100x-ing wind turbines, if it was linear, would still be a tiny number of bird deaths compared to other sources.

Well, we are trying to reduce the other numbers. 10 million in the US is still a big number. We are 4% of the world population. As per capita energy use increases throughout the world, we're going to generate a lot more clean energy.

http://world.bymap.org/ElectricityProduction.html

Is there a reason we need to kill tens of millions of additional birds every year so we can have "clean" energy?

Re: Live display of CO2 emitted to produce electricity in European countries

#159

Post by greglindahl »

melling wrote: post #158
greglindahl wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you look at the chart in the link, 100x-ing wind turbines, if it was linear, would still be a tiny number of bird deaths compared to other sources.

Well, we are trying to reduce the other numbers. 10 million in the US is still a big number. We are 4% of the world population. As per capita energy use increases throughout the world, we're going to generate a lot more clean energy. http://world.bymap.org/ElectricityProduction.html Is there a reason we need to kill tens of millions of additional birds every year so we can have "clean" energy?

10 million in the US is not a big number, relative to other sources of bird deaths. As long as it's insignificant, you'll have a hard time convincing people that it's significant, and should stand in the way of saving the planet.

Re: Live display of CO2 emitted to produce electricity in European countries

#160

Post by timthorn »

krona wrote: post #80
avar wrote: post #5

Does anyone know of interesting tours you can take of electricity production in Europe or energy infrastructure in general? I'm in The Netherlands, but would be willing to travel for it. A real tour of a nuclear plant would be awesome (i.e. getting to hear / see the reactor), but tours of wind farms / turbines / dams etc. would also be great. Preferably in English.

You can tour https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinorwig_Power_Station , which includes going deep in to the Elidir Fawr mountain, and tours around the turbine hall and other interesting things. Or at least you could 10 years ago.

You still can. Impressive bit of engineering.
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