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Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use

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Re: Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use

#51

Post by [deleted] »

myf01d wrote: post #45
kutkloon7 wrote: post #13

The arrest and torture of an exorbitant number of 'enemies of the state', including judges, police officers, and teachers, indicates more important problems in Turkey. For some reason, a lot of Turks still seem to support Erdogan. The West doesn't really care what he does, as long as Turkey takes care of most of the refugees. A disgusting European policy.

Because there is now a sufficient majority of Turks who want to destroy the secular Turkey, apply gradually more and more islamic country and get rid of Turkey's within enemies: Secular people and Kurds. Erdogan is just listening to the people like he says, he only additionally wants to destroy and humiliate his personal and political enemies because he is a psycho. Furthermore, he adores money, his family built an m…

[deleted]

Re: Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use

#52

Post by shsyqbaw »

myf01d wrote: post #45
kutkloon7 wrote: post #13

The arrest and torture of an exorbitant number of 'enemies of the state', including judges, police officers, and teachers, indicates more important problems in Turkey. For some reason, a lot of Turks still seem to support Erdogan. The West doesn't really care what he does, as long as Turkey takes care of most of the refugees. A disgusting European policy.

Because there is now a sufficient majority of Turks who want to destroy the secular Turkey, apply gradually more and more islamic country and get rid of Turkey's within enemies: Secular people and Kurds. Erdogan is just listening to the people like he says, he only additionally wants to destroy and humiliate his personal and political enemies because he is a psycho. Furthermore, he adores money, his family built an m…

That's a good question: if there's a majority of Turks who support the regime, what's the problem? Can't we like, leave them in peace? Do we have to impose western politics everywhere in the world??

Re: Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use

#53

Post by myf01d »

shsyqbaw wrote: post #52
myf01d wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because there is now a sufficient majority of Turks who want to destroy the secular Turkey, apply gradually more and more islamic country and get rid of Turkey's within enemies: Secular people and Kurds. Erdogan is just listening to the people like he says, he only additionally wants to destroy and humiliate his personal and political enemies because he is a psycho. Furthermore, he adores money, his family built an m…

That's a good question: if there's a majority of Turks who support the regime, what's the problem? Can't we like, leave them in peace? Do we have to impose western politics everywhere in the world??

The real question should be: Why does the US want to apply "democracy" and "human rights" using all means including interventions and civil wars like in Iraq, Syria and Libya but it acts as if there nothing happens for more criminal regimes like in Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Qatar?

Re: Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use

#54

Post by diego_moita »

kutkloon7 wrote: post #13

The arrest and torture of an exorbitant number of 'enemies of the state', including judges, police officers, and teachers, indicates more important problems in Turkey. For some reason, a lot of Turks still seem to support Erdogan. The West doesn't really care what he does, as long as Turkey takes care of most of the refugees. A disgusting European policy.

> A disgusting European policy.

I suggest you understand it before you criticize it. It is called Westphalian Sovereignity[0] and Europeans have very solid and good reasons for it.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westphalian_sovereignty

Re: Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use

#55

Post by Zenst »

shsyqbaw wrote: post #52
myf01d wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because there is now a sufficient majority of Turks who want to destroy the secular Turkey, apply gradually more and more islamic country and get rid of Turkey's within enemies: Secular people and Kurds. Erdogan is just listening to the people like he says, he only additionally wants to destroy and humiliate his personal and political enemies because he is a psycho. Furthermore, he adores money, his family built an m…

That's a good question: if there's a majority of Turks who support the regime, what's the problem? Can't we like, leave them in peace? Do we have to impose western politics everywhere in the world??

Real crux comes how the EU is bending over backwards to borg them and yet the majority of Europeans do not care for the state of Turkey and its actions, let alone absorbing them into the EU.

This and people confuse western politics with humanity and moral standards and that is an area in which Turkey is nose-diving at an alarming rate. Very concerning indeed :(.

Re: Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use

#56

Post by atmosx »

icebraining wrote: post #32
dijit wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually it was Britain who were arguing for their membership for years. Most of the EU was wildly sceptical due to an incompatiblility of cultures. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/11283...

Sir Humphrey Appleby: Minister, Britain has had the same foreign policy objective for at least the last 500 years: to create a disunited Europe. In that cause we have fought with the Dutch against the Spanish, with the Germans against the French, with the French and Italians against the Germans, and with the French against the Germans and Italians. Divide and rule, you see. Why should we change now, when it's worked…

YMPM is by far and large the best political satire show ever made.

Re: Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use

#57

Post by Zenst »

myf01d wrote: post #53
shsyqbaw wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a good question: if there's a majority of Turks who support the regime, what's the problem? Can't we like, leave them in peace? Do we have to impose western politics everywhere in the world??

The real question should be: Why does the US want to apply "democracy" and "human rights" using all means including interventions and civil wars like in Iraq, Syria and Libya but it acts as if there nothing happens for more criminal regimes like in Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Qatar?

Indeed and does highlight a level of corruption in which money allows you to get away with murder, most literally in some Middle Eastern countries you mention. This and the EU's pokemon attitude to the European tectonic pklate of got too collect them all, seems to allow some serious issues to get dismissed and overlooked in Turkey alone.

As for Qatar and Saudi Arabia, again, if they were not rich countries would they be allowed as much slack as they do.

Still, maybe people had enough of this level of corruption and double-standards being allowed; Which may in part explain how people vote in today's times.

Re: Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use

#59

Post by benevol »

rokosbasilisk wrote: post #42
eloy wrote: post #3

Events like this is the reason I operate a few Tor Bridges. It gives uncensored internet to vulnerable people in countries that are (semi-)dictatorships. The Streisand VPN includes a Tor Bridge by default, so if you ever have problems with an advanced firewall that blocks most VPN protocols, Streisand with Tor is your friend. Tor Bridges are also a nice playground for modern cryptography, they are working on PQ Crypt…

I think uncensored internet is under attack in general even in the america and europe. No one with power seems to like the idea of stuff they cant control.

> I think uncensored internet is under attack in general even in the america and europe

...where the actors are more subtle and use mass surveillance to manipulate people and undermine "dissidents".

Re: Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use

#60

Post by enraged_camel »

shsyqbaw wrote: post #52
myf01d wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because there is now a sufficient majority of Turks who want to destroy the secular Turkey, apply gradually more and more islamic country and get rid of Turkey's within enemies: Secular people and Kurds. Erdogan is just listening to the people like he says, he only additionally wants to destroy and humiliate his personal and political enemies because he is a psycho. Furthermore, he adores money, his family built an m…

That's a good question: if there's a majority of Turks who support the regime, what's the problem? Can't we like, leave them in peace? Do we have to impose western politics everywhere in the world??

>>if there's a majority of Turks who support the regime, what's the problem?

There are at least two problems.

First, the "will of the people" argument works only if there is a strong culture of democracy, respect for the rule of law and proper representation of minorities. None of those things exist in Turkey (I'm Turkish). Typically, what happens when Erdogan wins elections is that he views it as a "mandate" and starts oppressing the shit out of his opposition by jailing or exiling people who disagree with him. He has gone so far as to use his party to change laws in his favor. And all those infrastructure improvements he has made? They have all enriched himself and his buddies (called "crony capitalism").

Second, Turkey is an extremely important player in the Middle East. If we want the region to stop spiraling out of control, there needs to be a modern, stable and secular democracy with a Muslim population there that can be used as a model by other countries. Otherwise the region will always be in turmoil, which will inevitably spill over to Europe and the rest of the world (in the form of refugees, extremist terrorists, etc.).

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