An Ode to Linux Desktop Users Everywhere • Hacker News Board

Re: An Ode to Linux Desktop Users Everywhere

#121

Post by dashingdolphin » Wed, Dec 07, 2016, 12:46 AM UTC

vurpo wrote: post #115

dashingdolphin wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most things Just Work now. I would definitely agree this is true compared to "before". I remember fooling with Linux in the late 90s and getting graphics to work at a native resolution to my monitor and sound was a big accomplishment. In comparison to now, where out of the box on my slightly aged thinkpad I could use my touchstick, touchpad (with two finger scroll!), volume/brightness/media keys, etc. However, I th…

I believe the problem is that you can either get something that works, or you get something that is very open to tweaking. Systems that are very open to tweaking and changing things around just don't work as smoothly and easily as systems that "just work". And I think that's the reason why so many people are put off using desktops that aren't Windows or macOS. My computer is a tool, which I happen to use to develop s…

The thing is, Windows and macOS separately worked to expose a consistent model/metaphor of how your computer works for users to learn and understand. This model is an abstraction (and thus leaks), but they had a lot of time, money, and smart people to take a crack at it and it works pretty OK. Also, the model they've built is visual which has some benefits like discoverability -- for example, I learned about computers growing up essentially by clicking every button and seeing what what happened.

It's hard to really do that in Linux. It's functional because so many people can contribute all those little pieces, but that comes at a cost of consistency and often complexity. There are a lot of opaque moving parts in a Linux system, and I don't think that's a good thing. When I decided to use Linux on a personal computer, I tried a lot of different ones until I decided to use Void Linux. runit was a big part of that -- all the init systems I've touched over the years, nothing was as immediately simple and obvious to use or observe as runit.

Re: An Ode to Linux Desktop Users Everywhere

#122

Post by dman » Wed, Dec 07, 2016, 12:53 AM UTC

As an avid Linux user I used to be troubled by people claiming the utter unusability of Linux as a productive desktop environment. The thing that brought me some peace was the realization that a lot of the users that complain about desktop linux being broken want the computing equivalent of a Toyota Camry - something that takes them from point A to point B with a minimum of fuss. I would like to think of the Linux desktop environment as being closer to a Miata - something fun and enjoyable for those that are willing to accept different tradeoffs and enjoy being closer to the road.

Re: An Ode to Linux Desktop Users Everywhere

#123

Post by type0 » Wed, Dec 07, 2016, 3:04 AM UTC

qwertyuiop924 wrote: post #74

taeric wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oddly, the number one "I can't believe this doesn't just work category" is printers. It is frustrating that I can just start printing from my ubuntu machine, but have to figure out how to get the right drivers for my other machines. As a standard caveat, I don't actually use that many devices on my network. So, YMMV. A lot.

To contrast, IME, CUPS is a pain. Absolutely awful. Printing Just Works everywhere except Linux. And I'm using an EPSON printer, too.

Here is a guy also being terribly disappointed with Linux about CUPS to the point that he said he will stop using it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0chgyL7u4Qs

For me personally, I would rather buy a new printer, the freedom of being able to change the software to run the way I want it is worth so much more.

Re: An Ode to Linux Desktop Users Everywhere

#124

Post by type0 » Wed, Dec 07, 2016, 3:27 AM UTC

smhg wrote: post #32

Related to Ubuntu's Unity (might apply to other environments): I remember last time I switched from Windows (~3 years ago) it was once again harsh on my eyes. The way things (fonts?) are rendered is just different. What made me survive the first days was switching the default font to Roboto Condensed (of Google fame) [1] with: sudo apt-get install fonts-roboto unity-tweak-tool I wouldn't want to trade it for any othe…

First time I hear something other than praise for Ubuntu fonts. Bodhi Linux was the only distro I tried that had terrible fonts, all others were good or very good and I tried about 10 of them.

Re: An Ode to Linux Desktop Users Everywhere

#125

Post by levlaz » Wed, Dec 07, 2016, 4:16 AM UTC

dman wrote: post #122

As an avid Linux user I used to be troubled by people claiming the utter unusability of Linux as a productive desktop environment. The thing that brought me some peace was the realization that a lot of the users that complain about desktop linux being broken want the computing equivalent of a Toyota Camry - something that takes them from point A to point B with a minimum of fuss. I would like to think of the Linux de…

> I would like to think of the Linux desktop environment as being closer to a Miata - something fun and enjoyable for those that are willing to accept different tradeoffs and enjoy being closer to the road.

I really like this analogy.

Re: An Ode to Linux Desktop Users Everywhere

#126

Post by flukus » Wed, Dec 07, 2016, 4:36 AM UTC

rodolphoarruda wrote: post #48

I'm so glad this one reached the top page in HN. It's our chance to talk about it. I've been using Linux on my personal and professional desktops since 2006. I really enjoyed when Ubuntu got its presence and relevance in the scene, and I didn't mind when they decided to adopt Unity. KDE has always been my preferred option until I read an article where Linus T. said he used Gnome. So by the time I moved to Gnome I als…

I've been back on windows for ~10 years, mostly for gamin and work (.net dev). but I've always stayed away from SSD's because the get filled with so much bloatware on windows and the larger ones get very expensive very fast.

I just realized how effective smaller SSD's could be if I'd installed linux and avoided the bloat.

Re: An Ode to Linux Desktop Users Everywhere

#127

Post by smhg » Wed, Dec 07, 2016, 1:26 PM UTC

type0 wrote: post #124

smhg wrote: post #32

Related to Ubuntu's Unity (might apply to other environments): I remember last time I switched from Windows (~3 years ago) it was once again harsh on my eyes. The way things (fonts?) are rendered is just different. What made me survive the first days was switching the default font to Roboto Condensed (of Google fame) [1] with: sudo apt-get install fonts-roboto unity-tweak-tool I wouldn't want to trade it for any othe…

First time I hear something other than praise for Ubuntu fonts. Bodhi Linux was the only distro I tried that had terrible fonts, all others were good or very good and I tried about 10 of them.

I definitely didn't want to say they are bad.

For me, personally, the switch from Windows was rough. Not because I consider any of them to be superior, but because the way things are rendered is just so different.

A more compact font (the 'Condensed' part) helped me a lot.

So many other things (window animations, shadows, straight borders,...) I really love. And the compact font is the finishing touch for my untrained eye.

Re: An Ode to Linux Desktop Users Everywhere

#128

Post by BrandoElFollito » Wed, Dec 07, 2016, 8:43 PM UTC

I am a Linux fan since ca. 1993. Yesterday I tried once again to give a chance to ubuntu desktop on my dual boot Lenovo P50 with a docking station and two screens. Complete failure, the screens were not recognized, the cursor was leaving a trace, etc.

A complete failure.

So while Linux as a server is a dream came true, I will stick to Windows as my desktop OS.

Re: An Ode to Linux Desktop Users Everywhere

#129

Post by Anthony-G » Wed, Dec 07, 2016, 9:18 PM UTC

levlaz wrote: post #106

loudmax wrote: post #21

For anyone who misses it, this is a reference to Apple's 1997 Think Different marketing campaign. The original ode is here: http://www.thecrazyones.it/spot-en.html I'd forgotten about this campaign, and I would have missed the reference myself, but I just happened to listen to an audiobook chapter from Steve Jobs' biography yesterday.

> For anyone who misses it, this is a reference to Apple's 1997 Think Different marketing campaign. Yes, thank you! This post was careful crafted trolling. I am glad the not so subtle plagiarism was completely lost. ;)

As a happy Lubuntu user, I interpreted it as an homage to the original Think Different quote.

On a related note, the Atlantic has an interesting article on the Think Different advertising campaign: https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2011/12/true-...

Re: An Ode to Linux Desktop Users Everywhere

#130

Post by Anthony-G » Wed, Dec 07, 2016, 9:58 PM UTC

k__ wrote: post #53

nekopa wrote: post #47

I'm a very happy Xubuntu user. Have been for about 5 years, and even switched my partners laptop over to it a few months ago, after her win10 borked itself. Previously I used to dual boot windows and Slackware, but after 10 odd years on Slackware I wanted a Linux system I could just use and not spend every minute tweaking. I must be getting old. But I still have fond memories of plugging into Ethernet to get online w…

I'm using xubuntu for years now, but I have the feeling it got heavier every year. Now I'm searching for a better alternative

I’m a very happy user of Lubuntu on an 8-year old Dell laptop – with a modest Celeron 550 processor (I only recently got around to upgrading the RAM from 1GB to 2.5GB) and intend to follow it up with an SSD.

I’ve stuck with Lubuntu for the past 5 years or so after experimenting with briefly with Elementary OS and regular Ubuntu. I’ve never had any issue installing it and/or configuring it.