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Uber Now Tracks Passengers’ Locations Even After They’re Dropped Off

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Re: Uber Now Tracks Passengers’ Locations Even After They’re Dropped Off

#201

Post by loqwe »

bastawhiz wrote: post #142
ak2196 wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> The risk of abuse is exceptionally low. I call bullshit. This coming from the same guys who were mapping one night stands using ride data? What were you guys studying there. Fornicating habits of young adults in large metropolitans? http://www.whosdrivingyou.org/blog/ubers-deleted-rides-of-gl... I almost forgot about the time you guys were tracking journalists. Uber has a reputation and history of being a "shady"…

> Uber has a reputation and history of being a "shady" company. I'm not going to try to defend our reputation. But it's worth saying that things are locked down _pretty damn tight_ around sensitive data. I've worked in enterprise file storage in the past, and the internal security at Uber is far better (relatively speaking), and continues to mature.

It's not reassuring to hear that lowly engineers can't access the data, but the axe-grinding execs can.

Re: Uber Now Tracks Passengers’ Locations Even After They’re Dropped Off

#202

Post by xapata »

nojvek wrote: post #160
yladiz wrote: post #34

I saw this earlier and had hopes that the update would just let me choose "While Using" in the app settings, like some other apps allow you even if they request access even while not using the app, but the settings only allow for "Always" or "Never" on iPhone. However, you can use Uber without allowing GPS, so it's not all or nothing. I'm a little disturbed that they need any information after I use Uber though. They…

Well it's the same company that creepily gives me a code interview in the app because it knows I go to a software company couple of times a week and pushes a job ad. Uber has a lot of sensitive information regarding users. Who goes where and when. This in the wrong hand can be very disastrous. E.g Trump to Uber: "gimme list of all people who to to mosques frequently. No tax for you." Uber: "Here you go. Just don't te…

You do know that your phone company already has that info, right?

Re: Uber Now Tracks Passengers’ Locations Even After They’re Dropped Off

#203

Post by kaspiCZ »

brokenmachine wrote: post #199
null0pointer wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> as far as I know you only can see that some app is accessing your GPS currently, not which one(s) exactly On iOS if you go into [Settings > Privacy > Location Services] you can see which apps have used your location "recently" or in the last 24 hours. There is a legend at the bottom of that page for what the icons mean.

Is there any way to see on Android?

Settings > personal > location (Android 6 at least). You can disable the privilege in Settings > device > apps > Uber > permissions.

Re: Uber Now Tracks Passengers’ Locations Even After They’re Dropped Off

#204

Post by walterbell »

mortenjorck wrote: post #197
yladiz wrote: post #34

I saw this earlier and had hopes that the update would just let me choose "While Using" in the app settings, like some other apps allow you even if they request access even while not using the app, but the settings only allow for "Always" or "Never" on iPhone. However, you can use Uber without allowing GPS, so it's not all or nothing. I'm a little disturbed that they need any information after I use Uber though. They…

There's a simple way to send a message: Set the location services setting to "Never" and just enter addresses for now (copy and paste from Maps if it's easier). The important thing is that their analytics will pick this up, and if enough users do it, hopefully point toward re-enabling "While using."

Or don't accept this app update. If/when Uber stops the current app version (with 3 privacy settings) from working with their server API, switch from Uber to a competitor.

Apple can also change their policy for ride-sharing apps, to force "While Using" as an option, or block Uber's update from the App Store.

Remember that it was only after apps abused the contact database, that permissions were added by Apple to give users control over apps. Apple can step up now and define a new policy that responds to these new abuses of user choice, within the ride-sharing app category.

This is one of the few benefits of Apple's walled garden review of apps. Perhaps we will eventually thank Uber for pushing the boundaries of etiquette, forcing Apple to regulate Uber and their peers.

Re: Uber Now Tracks Passengers’ Locations Even After They’re Dropped Off

#205

Post by paulddraper »

berberous wrote: post #157
amluto wrote: post #26

I really wish that both Android and iOS had an option to outright prevent an app from doing anything in the background. No sensors, no location, no push notifications, no network access, no CPU time, URL protocols, no nothing. If I don't click the little app icon, the app shouldn't run, full stop.

I wish iOS forced all apps to offer "Always/While Using/Never" for location info. It's bullshit that Uber can refuse to offer the middle choice.

So...Uber has Always/Never functionality and you propose and change that makes the user choose Always/Never/Never?

Re: Uber Now Tracks Passengers’ Locations Even After They’re Dropped Off

#206

Post by ixacto »

bastawhiz wrote: post #91
yladiz wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but why does Uber need/care about that information? If I ask to be dropped off at X and walk a couple blocks to Y, Uber shouldn't care. I can understand the argument that maybe going to certain buildings you have to be dropped off at a specific spot, but that seems like a minor gain for something that's more than just a minor intrusion.

(Uber engineer here) The data is used for (or can be used for) a number of practical and important purposes. These are some examples of what we do as well as what we could do with such data: - Fighting fraud - Improving "suggested pickup" locations - Improvements around POOL (we'd rather suggest a location that's easy to pick up from than one that's unsafe) - Figuring out what side of the street you end up on (we can…

If you can't see the potential for abuse then you need to take a step back and look at things in a different perspective. There is a very real possibility that Uber could be hacked in the future, or has already been hacked. Can Ubers infrastructure withstand an Operation Aurora level attack?

Re: Uber Now Tracks Passengers’ Locations Even After They’re Dropped Off

#207

Post by xapata »

rm999 wrote: post #177
bastawhiz wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You missed my point. I said that if we accidentally started collecting all user locations, you wouldn't have to worry about us getting an NSL because our servers would have crashed and burned and no data would have managed to have been collected. Uber's infrastructure is completely incapable of handling that volume of data, because it was never designed to handle it. As far as software bugs go, accidentally collectin…

> Uber's infrastructure is completely incapable of handling that volume of data, The data volume isn't very big. Let's assume Uber records locations for 20 million users and pings each user every 5 minutes. We're talking about 20 million users * 12 events per hour * 24 hours * 16 bytes (my generous assumption of how much it would cost to store a user id, timestamp, and precise long/lat data) = ~100 GB a day or 3 TB a…

Only 12 events per hour? I'd guess you're off by an order of magnitude.

Re: Uber Now Tracks Passengers’ Locations Even After They’re Dropped Off

#208

Post by Too »

amluto wrote: post #26

I really wish that both Android and iOS had an option to outright prevent an app from doing anything in the background. No sensors, no location, no push notifications, no network access, no CPU time, URL protocols, no nothing. If I don't click the little app icon, the app shouldn't run, full stop.

It's tricky to get the ux of this right. Say you don't want to give Firefox background access because it should only be active while you are actively browsing. Then that one time when you are about to download a 4GB iso, you start the download and minimize the app or even close the phone, when you get back the download was cancelled after just 2%. :(

Not saying it can't be done, just that there are many corner cases that can easily "break the internet" for non tech users if not handled in a smart way.

Re: Uber Now Tracks Passengers’ Locations Even After They’re Dropped Off

#209

Post by wallace_f »

xapata wrote: post #202
nojvek wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well it's the same company that creepily gives me a code interview in the app because it knows I go to a software company couple of times a week and pushes a job ad. Uber has a lot of sensitive information regarding users. Who goes where and when. This in the wrong hand can be very disastrous. E.g Trump to Uber: "gimme list of all people who to to mosques frequently. No tax for you." Uber: "Here you go. Just don't te…

You do know that your phone company already has that info, right?

Fair point, however just because the phone company/NSA has this information, IMHO that doesn't make unnecessarily intrusive apps OK with me.

Re: Uber Now Tracks Passengers’ Locations Even After They’re Dropped Off

#210

Post by brokenmachine »

bastawhiz wrote: post #172
kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Uber's infrastructure is completely incapable of handling that volume of data, because it was never designed to handle it. That is completely irrelevant. The powers that be can siphon off the data as it comes in. The danger is in receiving excess data in the first place, making yourself a more enticing target for collection activities.

That Uber could have a bug that sends all location data is irrelevant. Google, Apple, Lyft, Yelp, Foursquare, Microsoft, or any other company that has any app that accesses and transmits location data could have an identical bug that presents an identical problem, and Google and Apple already regularly collect and transmit that data all the time without it being a bug. And being a bug of biblical proportions, it'll g…

I'm convinced!

Does uber offer a password/bank information storage service?

With such great security and unhackable storage, those are the next logical upgrade and would make a really great one-stop service for your customers.

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