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Visual Studio for Mac

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Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#131

Post by stinos »

marmaduke wrote: post #104
FlyingSnake wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you are a pro mainly using the Mac for professional work... This is extremely dishonest assessment that only 'Developers' do professional work. Mac is used by Engineers, CAD/CAM, designers, illustrators, artists, musicians, etc and to reduce it only to developers is disingenuous. I for one is happy with the new Mac and there are several people who've found it great for 'pro' use.

The mac users in science are also legion

Sometimes for reasons beyond my understanding: I've seen many people bent over a 15" MB playing with MRI images in matlab/spm/... It's hard imagining something with worse posture, less ergonomics and less efficient.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#132

Post by et-al »

FlyingSnake wrote: post #92
SiVal wrote: post #17

So Microsoft is treating the Mac more seriously as a professional platform while Apple is treating it less seriously? I'm not saying this in a snarky way; I mean it literally as a change of corporate strategies in both companies. Microsoft seems to be saying, If you are a pro mainly using the Mac for professional work, we want to do a better job of empowering you, and Apple seems to be saying, If you are a pro mainly…

> If you are a pro mainly using the Mac for professional work... This is extremely dishonest assessment that only 'Developers' do professional work. Mac is used by Engineers, CAD/CAM, designers, illustrators, artists, musicians, etc and to reduce it only to developers is disingenuous. I for one is happy with the new Mac and there are several people who've found it great for 'pro' use.

Pretty sure folks in the other professions mentioned are also lamenting over the missing successor to the Mac Pro, and the loss of not-yet-outdated ports on the MBP (especially since they probably have more peripheral devices than developers).

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#133

Post by jmkni »

Angostura wrote: post #124
jmkni wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I'm debugging in an IDE or through a browsers developer tools, I absolutely use the function keys to step through/into/out of code. What should I do instead? Serious question.

I would presume that if the application hasn't been updated for the Touchbar, the Touchbar would default to displaying ESC F1 F2 F3 F4 etc..

Still though, at the moment I can step through code without really thinking about it, partly because I know where the keys are based on how the keyboard feels, combined with the tactile feedback of pressing the buttons.

I would worry that with no physical presence on the keyboard, I would spend a lot more time looking at the keyboard figuring out where the function key I need is than actually getting things done.

I would be keen to see a review from somebody who uses the new Macbook Pro professionally as a developer to see if this is as much of an issue as I imagine it to be.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#134

Post by nicky0 »

Angostura wrote: post #124
jmkni wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I'm debugging in an IDE or through a browsers developer tools, I absolutely use the function keys to step through/into/out of code. What should I do instead? Serious question.

I would presume that if the application hasn't been updated for the Touchbar, the Touchbar would default to displaying ESC F1 F2 F3 F4 etc..

Actually Xcode has been updated for touchbar, and has some useful code editing commands. But does not show any debugging commands in the touchbar. Perhaps it will in future.

It is possible to show F keys by holding the fn key and you can configure the touchbar to always show F keys by default.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#136

Post by jeffhuys »

chj wrote: post #71
coldtea wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> WRONG. The removal of a dozen keys from an already gimped keyboard is decidedly anti-developer. I am a developer and I could not care less about function keys. Why the duck would developers need function keys? Even for Vim, the age-old advice is to remap Esc so that you keep your hands on the home row. A flexible multi-touch strip of context-aware keys can do much more things -- e.g. map debugger step moves when I'…

I care. I don't remember that advice, and I never have trouble relocating my fingers in sub seconds.

So you'd rather press F5 to build and F6 to debug instead of tapping "Build" or "Debug"?

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#137

Post by nicky0 »

erelde wrote: post #62
rimantas wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple is not saying anything like this, just a bunch of whiners twisting things. Just like they did after any Mac upgrade.

I don't know if it's just the usual whining of people complaining about new things. From the exterior (I'm too young and the only Mac I've ever used was the Macintosh Plus - bragging , with 4Mo of RAM- while I was a child), it really seems like Apple has dropped the ball for professionals, both developers and graphics people. There are now equally well designed PCs (laptops and desktops) from other manufacturers, Win…

> equally well designed PCs

That bit is debatable.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#138

Post by marmaduke »

stinos wrote: post #131
marmaduke wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The mac users in science are also legion

Sometimes for reasons beyond my understanding: I've seen many people bent over a 15" MB playing with MRI images in matlab/spm/... It's hard imagining something with worse posture, less ergonomics and less efficient.

mac has word, osirix and freesurfer etc but I agree about posture

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#139

Post by growse »

xrisk wrote: post #114
Kipters wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since we're talking about what is basically a rebrand of Xamarin Studio, the current release of Xamarin Studio for Mac uses the function keys for stepping in the debugger

Well, now they can use the touch bar to show those functions depending on context. Isn't that better overall for usability rather than having to remember keybinds for every action?

If I've got to constantly look between the screen and the keyboard to make sure my finger hasn't wandered off "step into" and onto "continue", then that feels much worse for usability.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#140

Post by jeffhuys »

Kipters wrote: post #88
Steeeve wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More than a few developers have spoken up on the issue here on HN. The escape key is commonly used, as are many other function keys. Other vendors have rolled out similar gadgets to apple and they've been rejected by the development community at large - which apple would have known because they don't implement things like that willy nilly.

Since we're talking about what is basically a rebrand of Xamarin Studio, the current release of Xamarin Studio for Mac uses the function keys for stepping in the debugger

For those apps you can just enable "function mode", if it's not already enabled by default.
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