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Donald Trump Is Elected President

nytimes.com

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Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#271

Post by fuqted »

Delmania wrote: post #134
themckman wrote: post #74

So, I voted for DJT (I like calling him that, for some reason). I didn't vote for him because I agreed with any of his policies (as best I can tell he never actually presented any during the course of his campaign) or because I thought he was the best representative for the people of this country. I did so for a couple of reasons: 1. I like a good underdog story. The people that support him, for a multitude of reason…

> . Yeah, there are some loud one saying some ridiculous things, but I refuse to believe that close to half the country hates people of color and wants to completely isolate us from the rest of the world by closing our borders. It just can't be true. You've never been to the deep south, much the south, have you? > 2. I believed he was the candidate with the biggest chance of winning that would bring about the biggest…

>non-white people will suffer

Please tell me how non-white Americans will suffer from the policies of Trump. I'd think, what with 65k Syrian refugees flooding in and flocking to places like California (where I live) and backed up by policies in to land them unskilled jobs, the minority demo would suffer much more than, for instance, some Americans having their illegal relatives deported for example.

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#272

Post by lordCarbonFiber »

vlunkr wrote: post #107
lordCarbonFiber wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does "socially conservative" mean in 2016 if not racist/sexist/homophobic? One of Trump's slogans was "Take America back"; that's not particularly subtle as to from who. The line gets a bit muddier on the fiscal side. If you're all for cutting programs that disproportionately support the poor and the poor happen to be disproportionately minority is there a racial component? That's worth being aware of.

Pro-life, opposed to drug legalization, 2nd amendment rights, to name a few. Sorry, but if that's what you think of all conservatives you have as much prejudice as you think they do.

Pro-life is pretty tightly coupled to the idea women don't have the right to manage their reproductive health-> not very equalist[0]. The drug war was started by Nixon inorder to better control the black and hippie population, so not getting any points there[1].

You're left with gun rights which becomes a question of degree. It's thankfully largely divorced from the issues of sex and race, but pretty tightly coupled to regional culture more than anything else.

The fact that Trump won on the backs of uneducated white men certainly says a lot.

[0] http://www.patheos.com/blogs/lovejoyfeminism/2012/10/how-i-l...

[1] http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-richa...

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#273

Post by gaur »

_audakel wrote: post #130
ap22213 wrote: post #87

I'll probably stop working for a while. I really don't want to support these creepy people in small town and rural america. They should no longer get my tax money to prop up their almost non-existent economies, and they certainly shouldn't enjoy a 1st world lifestyle on my back. No more 60-hour weeks for me. I'm retiring. I hope other follow. Maybe they'll finally get off their couch, turn off breitbart, and actually…

This attitude of categorizing large amounts of ppl "creepy ppl in small town" and refusing to see / accept that they have legitmate issues and greivanes is exactly why HRC lost. We can not just cut of or forget about a large portion of our nation bc we do not agree with them or we are not better than the Donald. Of all ppl, HN should see this as an opprotunity. Large pain points of rural america = massive startup opp…

p-e-o-p-l-e

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#274

Post by lern_too_spel »

curiousgeorgio wrote: post #52
phreack wrote: post #27

As an outsider, it is painfully clear that I should not try to move my business to the US at this point. Europe's looking better than ever now for tech startups.

For what it's worth, Trump's views are likely to be more advantageous for tech startups than Clinton's would have been.

By making access to workers more difficult or by repealing trade agreements that protect your startup's intellectual property and access to international markets?

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#275

Post by weaksauce »

gthtjtkt wrote: post #248
huac wrote: post #109

I have a lot of thoughts, but here's one: Hillary focused her entire campaign on why people should stop Trump, at the expense of talking about why she should be president. In general, making the case against someone else rather than the affirmative case for yourself doesn't work. It's reaction versus action. It's undoubtably true now that there was a very real populist anger towards the existing political order, and…

> at the expense of talking about why she should be president. Hillary couldn't make that argument because it would've drawn more attention to her most damning flaw: The fact that she's a textbook demagogue who was on the wrong side of every progressive issue until she found it politically expedient to "evolve". That's why so many people were so passionate about Sanders. You could go back to C-SPAN videos from 1992 a…

he would have been something you can set a clock to and someone that was on the right side of history before it was politically expedient to be on.

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#276

Post by adnzzzzZ »

SolaceQuantum wrote: post #188
belorn wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can think of several things, from cultural long term changes, rhetoric and acknowledge of human struggle, to smaller changes on the local level. We could start by not calling them privileged, demeaning them in their struggle. Acknowledging peoples struggle in life is often the first step in helping a demographic, be that women, black, white, immigrant, American born, or what have you. As cultural changes, one would…

I don't know about this one. I'm able-bodied and have 0 problems with being called privileged for being able bodied. I can hear well, I can see fine, I don't need any machines or devices to help me move around. In this respect I'm very privileged. I don't feel like I'm being demeaned by acknowledging this. It is actually to me acknowledging that other people struggle in ways that I do not. Similarly, I struggle to se…

The message focus and the message it sends to people is wrong. The signal is that there are systemic problems that can't be changed because people in power are guilty of having power. "White privilege" falls into a mentality that I call victimization, where instead of people looking at things through the lens of "how can I change myself and be better", they look at it through the lens of "how can others change themselves to help me be better". This is a hopeless signal that doesn't help anyone.

What we should be saying to people is that they should strive to be better because that's the only sure way they can hope to improve their situations. Waiting for other people to help you isn't going to do anything. The only thing you have control over is your own life. If the public discourse around these issues focuses solely on how other people have control and how you have no control, then the situation only becomes worse because then people have an excuse to not try, and they don't.

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#277

Post by rahkiin »

lordnacho wrote: post #81
SolaceQuantum wrote: post #17

Now that the voices of the disenfranchised blue collar workers have been heard, what actually can be done to help them? I'm less worried about the accusations of racism, etc. because it appears to me a majority are voting because their livelihoods have been lost and, despite economics saying globalization will bring new jobs, they aren't showing up in the critical areas where they are needed. So, what policies can be…

Jobs that can't be exported are safe from movement. Hairdressing and cleaning for instance. That doesn't mean the person doing it can't be an immigrant, though, so perhaps by restricting immigration you reduce competition for it. Jobs that compete with similar jobs in other countries can potentially benefit from trade barriers. Make foreign cars expensive and there will be substitution with local cars. Long term it's…

Re higher minimum wage. (using real numbers here, for the Netherlands)

For a support job, I want to employ a uneducated person. Just answering calls and clicking some buttons. (Could also be a student, no need for any experience etc) Costs me maybe 10 euros per hour. Why a student? Is relatively cheap and it gets the job done nicely. Now, if the minimum wage would go to 14 or more, what would happen? Would I still employ this student for the same task? Maybe (probably?) not. Maybe I will instead get a 20 euro worker with an education that can not only do support but also some development and can bring knowledge into the company.

Saying that increasing minimum wage solves problems directly is, I think, wrong, because everything might shift.

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#278

Post by hx87 »

woodchuck64 wrote: post #180
belorn wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can think of several things, from cultural long term changes, rhetoric and acknowledge of human struggle, to smaller changes on the local level. We could start by not calling them privileged, demeaning them in their struggle. Acknowledging peoples struggle in life is often the first step in helping a demographic, be that women, black, white, immigrant, American born, or what have you. As cultural changes, one would…

> We could start by not calling them privileged, demeaning them in their struggle. We don't call them privileged. Rather, they hear the insults and put-downs they want to hear by tuning in to customized news and propaganda that confirm their deepest insecurities. > As cultural changes, one would be to lower the harm from being unemployed. For men, too much of social value and social opportunity is tied to being emplo…

>Re-engineering the social brain so that status doesn't matter?

Status will always matter, but you can change the signifiers of status. There are plenty of places in, for example, rural China where women do most of the work while the men mostly stay home, and yet the men do not lack for status because of that.

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#280

Post by inimino »

bbctol wrote: post #129
inimino wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll play: 6 is a given, 3 is on the table but wouldn't be easy. The rest range from unlikely to impossible.

Why wouldn't 3 be easy, given the makeup of the Senate and House?

Because it's already in place, and some of those folks in the House and Senate might want to get elected again.
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