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Social media shutdown in Turkey

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Re: Social media shutdown in Turkey

#61

Post by markdown »

hackuser wrote: post #56
myf01d wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1) Mubarak was elected democratically in 2005. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egyptian_presidential_election... 2) Mubarak was also forced to resign by the same military council in February 2011 and the military council ruled until June 2012 when morsi was elected, it just wasn't called a "coup" and "military dictatorship" back then by the western media.

> 1) Mubarak was elected democratically in 2005. Stalin and many (most?) other dictators also have staged elections. From the article you linked: ---- Of the 30 proposed candidates, only 10 were allowed to participate in the presidential election by the Presidential Election Commission. One prominent candidate not allowed to run was Talaat Sadat, the nephew of former President Anwar Sadat, who appealed his disqualifi…

> The highest in U.S. history was 61%.

That's not surprising since the US doesn't make election day a public holiday.

Re: Social media shutdown in Turkey

#62

Post by tdkl »

hackuser wrote: post #42
myf01d wrote: post #14

Turkey, Qatar and Saudi Arabia -> Friends Syria, Iran and Russia -> Enemies That's how pay for play works, everybody. If you don't pay, your government is labeled as a dictatorship. Simply fallen from the US grace. The UN is just a diplomatic tool to discredit you and NATO is another tool to kill you.

I'm pretty confident that it has nothing to do with pay, but with geopolitics. In fact, I think the U.S. generally gives them more money (and other aid) than vice versa. The former three are allies and provide essential value to the U.S. Off the top of my head: Turkey gives NATO an very valuable geopolitical position, with leverage as the most powerful nation in the Mideast neighborhood, as well as dominating the Bla…

Well, parent was trying to highlight that what you wrote should be a footnote every time there are big words of bringing "democracy" to other countries by the said actors.

Re: Social media shutdown in Turkey

#63

Post by tdkl »

myf01d wrote: post #27
denfromufa wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does this have to do with actual censorship, shutting down media, and jailing of journalists critical to Erdogan?

I am from Egypt, I remember very well, when the revolution of June 2013 broke out against the muslim brotherhood, the US said it stands with the "legitimate" regime (back then morsi), when they were toppled, the US said it was coup (funny they said it was a revolution when it was against Mubarak). And everyone here is suffering from an unofficial economic embargo enforced by the US on us ever since. It is simply a co…

We've always been at war with Eastasia.

Re: Social media shutdown in Turkey

#64

Post by triplesec »

myf01d wrote: post #60
hackuser wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1) Mubarak was elected democratically in 2005. Stalin and many (most?) other dictators also have staged elections. From the article you linked: ---- Of the 30 proposed candidates, only 10 were allowed to participate in the presidential election by the Presidential Election Commission. One prominent candidate not allowed to run was Talaat Sadat, the nephew of former President Anwar Sadat, who appealed his disqualifi…

Still not more dictatorial than detaining tens of thousands and even freeing thousand of criminals to get some room for the alleged coup plotters, a coup where a couple of hundred young soldiers most of whom didn't even know what was going on, and laying off hundreds of thousands of people from all professions (academia, sport, journalism). At the same time, his army is crushing kurd civilians not only in Turkey, but…

So they're all rubbish. What would constitute a good system of government in Egypt?

Re: Social media shutdown in Turkey

#65

Post by triplesec »

dibstern wrote: post #39
234dd57d2c8db wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So democracy is working as intended, the people decided. Just because you don't agree with the results of democracy doesn't invalidate it.

Except democracy relies on freedom of the press in order to operate. Brainwashing a population into supporting one guy and holding elections every so often to confirm the brainwashing is working isn't democracy.

Exactly it. Turkey is operating like Putin's Russia. IT's on the way to the same model.

Re: Social media shutdown in Turkey

#66

Post by triplesec »

enraged_camel wrote: post #16
dogma1138 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hitler got rid of the brown coats when he didn't need them anymore also. Fethullah Gulen and Erdogan were besties until about 3 years ago. It's also a bit funny that you call this guy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fethullah_G%C3%BClen a Terrorist, if he is he has the best poker face of all of them so far. While he probably has more than one agenda, neither the US, Israel nor any EU nation has never put him or his fol…

I never called him a terrorist. Please read more carefully. Also, since you obviously haven't read the link I provided, here's an excerpt from a speech he gave in 1999 in which he talks about... well, I'll let you be the judge: "You must move in the arteries of the system without anyone noticing your existence until you reach all the power centers. . . . Until the conditions are ripe, they [the followers] must contin…

Need a source for that quotation, or it could be from anywhere.

Re: Social media shutdown in Turkey

#67

Post by jospoortvliet »

hackuser wrote: post #42
myf01d wrote: post #14

Turkey, Qatar and Saudi Arabia -> Friends Syria, Iran and Russia -> Enemies That's how pay for play works, everybody. If you don't pay, your government is labeled as a dictatorship. Simply fallen from the US grace. The UN is just a diplomatic tool to discredit you and NATO is another tool to kill you.

I'm pretty confident that it has nothing to do with pay, but with geopolitics. In fact, I think the U.S. generally gives them more money (and other aid) than vice versa. The former three are allies and provide essential value to the U.S. Off the top of my head: Turkey gives NATO an very valuable geopolitical position, with leverage as the most powerful nation in the Mideast neighborhood, as well as dominating the Bla…

With regards to Saudi Arabia and stability - that might have been a rather short term decision then...

http://www.worldaffairsjournal.org/article/saudi-connection-...

Re: Social media shutdown in Turkey

#68

Post by jospoortvliet »

markdown wrote: post #61
hackuser wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1) Mubarak was elected democratically in 2005. Stalin and many (most?) other dictators also have staged elections. From the article you linked: ---- Of the 30 proposed candidates, only 10 were allowed to participate in the presidential election by the Presidential Election Commission. One prominent candidate not allowed to run was Talaat Sadat, the nephew of former President Anwar Sadat, who appealed his disqualifi…

> The highest in U.S. history was 61%. That's not surprising since the US doesn't make election day a public holiday.

he didn't mean attendance but percentage of votes for the winner.

Re: Social media shutdown in Turkey

#69

Post by jospoortvliet »

hackuser wrote: post #46
myf01d wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. These governments are for example "donating" hundreds of millions every year to many politicians in the US. One of them is may be going to be the next president. 2. Look at the ads and sponsors in the big news channels like CNN, mostly institutions and companies owned by these countries (Qatar airways, Turkish airlines, Dubai, Abu Dhabi...), no wonder on the day of the "coup" against Erdogan, These media outlets l…

> 1. These governments are for example "donating" hundreds of millions every year to many politicians in the US ... They do invest, though I'd need evidence of hundreds of millions. Regardless, the U.S. has very strong geopolticial reasons to support them: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12870161 > no wonder on the day of the "coup" against Erdogan, These media outlets labeled his "supporters" as pro-democracy.…

Mubarak was elected in an election about as free as the last one for Erdogan. Where Mubarak jailed most opposition and killed and bombed their supporters into submission, Erdogan jailed them and killed and bombed their supporters into submission.

Re: Social media shutdown in Turkey

#70

Post by jospoortvliet »

234dd57d2c8db wrote: post #32
Fluid_Mechanics wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, you seem to be making a plethora of paranoid generalizations, care to back up any of that with evidence?

Saudi Arabia was (until massive backlash and attention) on the Human Rights board of the UN. You know, the country that stones women and sponsors terrorism. In a totally unrelated series of events, they have also donated millions upon millions of dollars to the election campaigns of US officials. Surly Saudi Arabia is just a powerhouse when it comes to Human Rights and they really deserved that spot. Please note, thi…

Indeed. And SA is where most modern 'terrorists' come from, btw: http://www.worldaffairsjournal.org/article/saudi-connection-...
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