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Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

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Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#81

Post by rawfan »

tankenmate wrote: post #30
elorant wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a former smoker I believe that the best way to quit smoking is cold turkey. Sure, the withdrawal phase is a hell but in my case that helped me realize just how addictive that shit was. Before I’d never imagine that quitting would cause me depression or sleeping problems. All that, and a lot more, helped me understand how much my body was reliant on cigarettes. From my experience most smokers don’t realize how addi…

And yet the numbers say that people who go through phased withdrawal using e-cigarettes are more likely to give up...

I remember reading a study done in the UK that said the exact opposite. 70% of people going cold-turkey were able to quit for good. They compared it to the number of people quitting using helping substitutes (like patches, ecigs and whatnot) where the success rate was way lower.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#82

Post by salemh »

jrockway wrote: post #20
stinos wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I also highly recommend e-cigarettes, your story is of course the ideal picture of how it should go. But it might not go that easy for everyone: even with the use of it I'm having a hard time to quit the actual cigarretes completely and it's not due to the nicotine (in fact I do not know what exactly still makes me crave for those hand-rolled cigarettes). Also nicotine can be a pleasant drug to use. Which is li…

I'm not sure why the goal is quitting. Nicotine itself isn't the problem with cigarettes, it's just a stimulant and has the usual stimulant effects. If you have high blood pressure or trouble sleeping, probably not a great drug to use. But the same can be said of coffee, which is perfectly legal. https://www.gwern.net/Nicotine is interesting reading. Of course, e-cigarette liquid is not only nicotine, so who knows wh…

Indeed. What e-cigarettes have done for me, and a few friends who have quit smoking, is help alleviate (my friends, who then later completely quit all e-ciggs), or replace (myself) the habitual addiction of cigarettes. Namely, the act of puffing, exhaling, and the sociability of going outside, etc.

That's a big part of the cigarettes many persons (anecdota) have trouble with quitting outside of the addictive properties: the learned habits.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#83

Post by mcguire »

SimpleXYZ wrote: post #78

>Use of the devices is slumping because they are not as good as cigarettes at giving a hit of nicotine This is total nonsense. You can use e-juice at a level that will give you nicotine poisoning.

IIUC, cigarettes have been chemically modified to increase the rate of the nicotine hit, to get nicotine through the bloodstream to where it does its nicotiney job. That's one of the reasons cigarettes are more addictive: the sudden hit followed by a quick drop off.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#84

Post by yuubi »

rawfan wrote: post #74

I quit smoking 7 years ago and helped a dozen people to quit as well. NONE of the people I know who used e-cigarettes were able to quit for good. Here's my recipe: 1. Quitting sounds hard but it isn't. The majority of people who try to quit, actually succeed. 2. Don't use ANYTHING as a substitute (no chewing gum, no patches or e-cigs). Substitutes usually can never replace the original and will just keep you "hooked"…

And the one person I know who had tried various ways to quit over the years got a vape set, tapered down gradually to no cigarettes over about 6 weeks (I think on day 1 she only had half a pack instead of her usual ≥ 1 pack habit), and hasn't had an actual cigarette in over 2 years. Different people seem to respond better to different approaches.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#85

Post by rsync »

josho wrote: post #31
jrockway wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure why the goal is quitting. Nicotine itself isn't the problem with cigarettes, it's just a stimulant and has the usual stimulant effects. If you have high blood pressure or trouble sleeping, probably not a great drug to use. But the same can be said of coffee, which is perfectly legal. https://www.gwern.net/Nicotine is interesting reading. Of course, e-cigarette liquid is not only nicotine, so who knows wh…

> Nicotine itself isn't the problem with cigarettes, it's just a stimulant and has the usual stimulant effects Agreed, it's tobacco that is the primary issue. I've been curious to adopt the e-cig for the stimulant aspect. I likely won't, but will admit to being curious if it would be a productivity boost. I'd bet the e-cig companies could gain a whole new market if they published some quasi-scientific material on the…

Wouldn't the gum be easier and more discreet ?

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#86

Post by mcguire »

exprA wrote: post #73
foobarchu wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a couple of big things against them right now. A) they are unproven. Many people believe that something that isn't proven safe or unsafe is not better than something unsafe that has been heavily scrutinized and studied. What if there's a much worse effect that we dont' know about yet? B) They are unstandardized. Each producer can be putting who-knows-what in the oils. C) It's still smoke. When they first came…

It isn't smoke, and it isn't burnt plant matter. In theory the vapour might have as strong a smell as cigarette smoke; in practice even the most strong smelling vapours are mostly comparable to the smell of personal fragrances, and we are ways off from banning those as well.

On the other hand, it's a big thick cloud of vapor coming from someone's mouth.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#87

Post by no_wave »

We actually don't know that they're safer to puff. We simply don't have any evidence that indicates that they're as or more dangerous.

Every variety of plastic or food additive that ended up being proved harmful was thought safe for years. People are right to be skeptical of them for the next thirty years or so.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#88

Post by nom »

snarfy wrote: post #47
Spooky23 wrote: post #38

How do you know they are safer? My understanding was that many ingredients, particularly for flavored formulas are proprietary and unknown.

I make my own unflavored VG/PG e-juice. I buy the nicotine separately. I don't like the idea of inhaling flavors. I just want the nicotine. But yes, you are correct. A lot of the flavors are not regulated. I recall there was an issue with a carmel like flavor recently.

I also omit the flavors to minimize the risks. I also vape only on very low settings and with increased nicotine.

I see people using devices beyond 150W and super hot coils to 'make dem sick clouds'. They have essentially created some nice portable catalytic converters. You can even buy coils made from different alloys like Ni-Ti and some devices measure the coil resistance to control the temperature.

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#89

Post by mcguire »

SparkyMcUnicorn wrote: post #54
Spooky23 wrote: post #38

How do you know they are safer? My understanding was that many ingredients, particularly for flavored formulas are proprietary and unknown.

It's true that flavorings are the biggest variable and it's a risk that people are taking because many feel that risk is extremely low. For example; some flavorings contain diacetyl which, if inhaling too much, will lead to Bronchiolitis Obliterans or "popcorn lung", but the amount actually inhaled in e-cigarettes is 750 times less than cigarettes and vastly less than the amount inhaled by people that have developed…

For anyone who hasn't followed this, "popcorn lung"[1] is named that because it was found in workers at factories making (microwave?) popcorn products. In other words, they were dealing with diacetyl in industrial quantities.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bronchiolitis_obliterans

Re: Safer to Puff, E-Cigarettes Can’t Shake Their Reputation as a Menace

#90

Post by zamalek »

SimpleXYZ wrote: post #78

>Use of the devices is slumping because they are not as good as cigarettes at giving a hit of nicotine This is total nonsense. You can use e-juice at a level that will give you nicotine poisoning.

I find that I sometimes still crave a cigarette. I suspect that has more to do one or more of the 599 additives (4000 when burnt)[1] in them being addictive.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_additives_in_cigarette...

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