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The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

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Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#121

Post by AsyncAwait »

cm2187 wrote: post #112
LeanderK wrote: post #13

> Hotz's initial tweets suggested his move was in response to an inquiry from NHTSA, stating that he "would much rather spend life building amazing tech than dealing with regulators and lawyers," well, this is not some stupid web-app that can't harm anyone even if it tried (except from maybe overheating your smartphone). This can kill people, i can't seriously buy dangerous stuff from somebody that says something lik…

> stupid web-app that can't harm anyone even if it tried (except from maybe overheating your smartphone) It can leak very sensitive personal data. That won't hurt you physically but will surely have consequences. The problem is perhaps the lack of regulations in the web-app domain. Any amateur can call himself a programmer and many do.

> The problem is perhaps the lack of regulations in the web-app domain.

There are and perhaps should be more regulations about safeguarding personal information, which for websites would mean salting passwords etc., but I am glad there are no regulations regarding who can and cannot program as that would seriously hurt innovation.

Maybe Linus wouldn't be able to program Linux? or Zuckerberg Facebook?

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#122

Post by csixty4 »

csixty4 wrote: post #27
noonespecial wrote: post #2

There's 2 possible reasons. 1) It really is near vaporware just being shown off in perfect conditions to seem exceptional. 2) It actually does work that much better with only $1000 worth of hardware and responding would give away the secret sauce. I don't give much credit to the theory that they didn't see this coming and were caught flat-footed by the sudden requirements. Oh and: Final speculation: there’s a reason…

This thread makes me happy.

Wow. When I posted this, the only replies were about the Commodore line. Now there's an actual conversation going on!

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#123

Post by jacquesm »

AsyncAwait wrote: post #119
dpark wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe in a couple months we are going to hear about the imminent release of the Comma Two in Not-America. I seriously doubt they've gone home. There are tons of places where they could starting selling right NOW. Then I'm very thankful for the NHTSA we have in America. I don't want a bunch of half-ass, poorly-engineered self-driving cars on our roads. I use those roads, and so do my family members. While I'm lookin…

> Then I'm very thankful for the NHTSA we have in America. I don't want a bunch of half-ass, poorly-engineered self-driving cars on our roads. I use those roads, and so do my family members. That sounds like you think that other countries would allow "a bunch of half-ass, poorly-engineered self-driving cars on our roads"? As an EU citizen, I can assure you that this is widely off the mark.

I don't think he made any statements about the rest of the world, he just made a statement about his local situation without any implications aimed elsewhere.

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#125

Post by cm2187 »

AsyncAwait wrote: post #121
cm2187 wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> stupid web-app that can't harm anyone even if it tried (except from maybe overheating your smartphone) It can leak very sensitive personal data. That won't hurt you physically but will surely have consequences. The problem is perhaps the lack of regulations in the web-app domain. Any amateur can call himself a programmer and many do.

> The problem is perhaps the lack of regulations in the web-app domain. There are and perhaps should be more regulations about safeguarding personal information, which for websites would mean salting passwords etc., but I am glad there are no regulations regarding who can and cannot program as that would seriously hurt innovation. Maybe Linus wouldn't be able to program Linux? or Zuckerberg Facebook?

The current pace of large data leaks is alarming and unsustainable. Any other industry that would fail so badly would be completely taken over by regulations. The silicon valley is only keeping its independence because until now politicians didn't really grasp the scope of the problem. But now that data leaks involve their own email, I suspect Washington is going to start paying attention.

Yes, regulations do hurt innovation and also competition, it creates large barriers to entry (check how many new banking licenses are issued every years!). But the current state of infosec is just unacceptable. It's like if planes were falling from the sky every day.

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#126

Post by inimino »

objclxt wrote: post #69
dilemma wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China has the same level of regulation as other industrialized countries. If it doesn't pass in the US it won't pass in China either.

> China has the same level of regulation as other industrialized countries. I have to assume you've never driven or been driven in a major Chinese city, because while this may be technically true in practice it is very much not. Cars on the road in China are often lacking in terms of safety. It is something of a moot point, because I don't see how any self driving car system could perform in Beijing traffic condition…

Driving on the sidewalk may be easier in China, but selling a self-driving add-on won't be.

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#127

Post by smrtinsert »

gst wrote: post #100
agildehaus wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There were major problems with every demo I saw of the product. In one video, the camera lost tracking of the road due to lighting conditions not being favorable for contrast. In another, Hotz seemed far too amazed that the car properly took a gentle bend in the highway. Confidence is not something I would assign to his product. Or any product that is a camera-only lane-follower. That Holtz caves at the slightest tho…

> There were major problems with every demo I saw of the product. Doesn't surprise me, after reading http://www.bloomberg.com/features/2015-george-hotz-self-driv... : "Instead of the hundreds of thousands of lines of code found in other self-driving vehicles, Hotz’s software is based on about 2,000 lines." In general I like the approach of using deep-learning instead of complex hardcoded rules (see the article above…

Who brags about 2000 loc when safety is at risk? Seems very immature, and not confidence inspiring.

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#129

Post by ethanbond »

Fricken wrote: post #99
ethanbond wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You think maybe part of why there haven't been more numerous malfunctions might be because of rigorous NHSTA testing of various parts of the automobile? Also just because a person on birth control gets pregnant doesn't mean we start pushing pills with unknown success rates in order to get people to use condoms.

If you're imagining that autopilot is anything more than driver assist technology, then there already is numerous malfunctions, autopilot fucks up regularly. With or without NHTSAs involvement, Autopilot (or Comma one) wasn't designed to be safety critical autonomous driving technology. NHTSA has about as much business regulating it as it does regulating whether or not you can hang dice on your rear view mirror. If i…

Nope. I'm imagining that NHSTA keeps people safe, and I don't want a car anywhere near me that's controlled by something that the NHSTA hasn't had a chance to even evaluate.

Re: The Cancelled Comma One Would Have Embarrassed the Car Industry

#130

Post by bertiewhykovich »

Fricken wrote: post #99
ethanbond wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You think maybe part of why there haven't been more numerous malfunctions might be because of rigorous NHSTA testing of various parts of the automobile? Also just because a person on birth control gets pregnant doesn't mean we start pushing pills with unknown success rates in order to get people to use condoms.

If you're imagining that autopilot is anything more than driver assist technology, then there already is numerous malfunctions, autopilot fucks up regularly. With or without NHTSAs involvement, Autopilot (or Comma one) wasn't designed to be safety critical autonomous driving technology. NHTSA has about as much business regulating it as it does regulating whether or not you can hang dice on your rear view mirror. If i…

It's foolish to believe that real humans, driving real cars, will treat these technologies as mere "driver-assists." Autopilot is used -- shockingly enough -- as an autopilot. And even if they /were/ used perfectly, these systems are exerting physical control over the car -- something that the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has a distinct interest in managing. The NHTSA would be grossly negligent if they did not attempt to regulate these devices.
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