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No One Saw Tesla’s Solar Roof Coming

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Re: No One Saw Tesla’s Solar Roof Coming

#121

Post by eric_h »

jackmott wrote: post #56
wojcech wrote: post #38

I'm sure i'm not the only one who feels like this is possibly the iphone moment of Solarcity/Tesla: an old-ish idea, made sexy and tasty to consumers, together with technology reaching a tipping point(and also Musk again finding a way to maximally exploit government subsidies for clean tech.) The tesla car itself could count as well, but felt less "design driven" imo. If this fails, everyone will call it obviously du…

fossil fuel industry people are somehow able to forget that they get subsidies right now every time they comment about clean tech subsidies.

I think it's more that they're counting on the consumers of their comments to forget that fact. I'm quite certain they all remember it.

Re: No One Saw Tesla’s Solar Roof Coming

#122

Post by lovemenot »

robterrell wrote: post #77

Side topic, but I wonder if there's a pivot point coming where household appliances could be offered in DC versions. It would be great to avoid the inverter efficiency loss / point of failure. Could there be a standard DC interior wiring system with line voltage for the fridge / dishwasher / laundry machines and let's say LED lights, phone chargers, etc? The need for AC power is just an artifact of long transmission…

A few years ago the Economist argued that USB is already becoming just such a domestic DC standard.

http://www.economist.com/news/international/21588104-humble-...

Re: No One Saw Tesla’s Solar Roof Coming

#123

Post by igravious »

philipkglass wrote: post #64
smoyer wrote: post #24

If the solar shingles last far longer than my current shingles (which actually need to be replaced soon), what about the degradation of the solar cells themselves? Traditional PV panels degrade and have to be replaced sooner than many roofing materials.

There are a lot of different degradation mechanisms that affect silicon based PV modules. http://www1.eere.energy.gov/solar/pdfs/pvrw2010_wohlgemuth_s... Most typical failures are thermomechanical fatigue and chemical breakdown of encapsulant and backsheet materials. Musk said that these are made of quartz (vitreous silica?) which has a very low coefficient of thermal expansion and should reduce thermomechanical fati…

Thanks for the informative comment. Tesla/SolarCity and Panasonic seem to be increasingly joined at the hip, don't they? That's be some merger. Who'd swallow who?

Re: No One Saw Tesla’s Solar Roof Coming

#124

Post by seanalltogether »

robterrell wrote: post #77

Side topic, but I wonder if there's a pivot point coming where household appliances could be offered in DC versions. It would be great to avoid the inverter efficiency loss / point of failure. Could there be a standard DC interior wiring system with line voltage for the fridge / dishwasher / laundry machines and let's say LED lights, phone chargers, etc? The need for AC power is just an artifact of long transmission…

I believe the biggest issue right now with internal DC wiring is you need much higher gauge wire, which translates to more expensive cabling throughout the house. You also still need a way to step the voltage for each device, so it's not clear what the savings are. It may be beneficial for lights where a clear standard for voltage can be determined, but everything else will still have it's own requirements.

Re: No One Saw Tesla’s Solar Roof Coming

#125

Post by GregBuchholz »

fweespeech wrote: post #79
GregBuchholz wrote: post #27

I'm curious if anyone has stats on what percentage of houses have an unobstructed southern roof (for those in the Northern hemisphere)? My house has seasonally adjusted nanotechnology self-replicating shade "panels" that block considerable sunlight in the spring and summer months (MTBF: 100+ years). The big downside is cleaning up the unused panels in the autumn.

That has to be the geekiest explanation of a tree I've seen in awhile.

How about from a marketing perspective?

Solar 'Sorb(TM) -- The revolutionary shade technology which keeps you cooler in the summer and warmer in winter. Innovative "cell" technology is at the heart of the Solar 'Sorb system. Proprietary nanotechnology utilizes clean solar energy, water and air to fill your yard with beautiful fractal-inspired spires, that not only look great, but save you money. And there is no complicated setup or programming. The Solar 'Sorb keeps track of the seasons by monitoring the length of day, and adjusts it shade profile to match. Some of the features included in each base model :

    Seasonally Adjusted Shade  
    Evaporative Cooling        
    Low Annual Maintenance     
    Provides shelter for fauna 
    Wind resistant             
    Limited Lifetime Warranty
The Solar 'Sorb comes in an exciting array of styles, each specifically adapted to your particular environment. And if you have a sweet tooth, you may be interested in our food bearing models which produce tasty and nutritious food packets for you and your family.

You can purchase fully functioning Solar 'Sorb units at one of our many worldwide distributors, or the do-it-yourselfer can order our starter kit pods direct from the factory. StarterPods(R) unfold gradually after installation and provide shade generation precisely where you need it.

Solar 'Sorb is a strong advocates for the environment, and that's why all of our products are certified "Green", and carbon neutral.

Re: No One Saw Tesla’s Solar Roof Coming

#126

Post by [deleted] »

fweespeech wrote: post #79
GregBuchholz wrote: post #27

I'm curious if anyone has stats on what percentage of houses have an unobstructed southern roof (for those in the Northern hemisphere)? My house has seasonally adjusted nanotechnology self-replicating shade "panels" that block considerable sunlight in the spring and summer months (MTBF: 100+ years). The big downside is cleaning up the unused panels in the autumn.

That has to be the geekiest explanation of a tree I've seen in awhile.

[deleted]

Re: No One Saw Tesla’s Solar Roof Coming

#127

Post by [deleted] »

fweespeech wrote: post #79
GregBuchholz wrote: post #27

I'm curious if anyone has stats on what percentage of houses have an unobstructed southern roof (for those in the Northern hemisphere)? My house has seasonally adjusted nanotechnology self-replicating shade "panels" that block considerable sunlight in the spring and summer months (MTBF: 100+ years). The big downside is cleaning up the unused panels in the autumn.

That has to be the geekiest explanation of a tree I've seen in awhile.

[deleted]

Re: No One Saw Tesla’s Solar Roof Coming

#128

Post by refurb »

aerovistae wrote: post #46
wojcech wrote: post #38

I'm sure i'm not the only one who feels like this is possibly the iphone moment of Solarcity/Tesla: an old-ish idea, made sexy and tasty to consumers, together with technology reaching a tipping point(and also Musk again finding a way to maximally exploit government subsidies for clean tech.) The tesla car itself could count as well, but felt less "design driven" imo. If this fails, everyone will call it obviously du…

Another side note: it always annoys me when people insinuate that Musk using government funds is a bad thing. The government is literally just US....it's our money and a collection of individuals from among us who we've appointed to handle the general administration of us and the space we take up. Why should American entrepreneurs, particularly ones doing such an outstanding job of moving technology in a positive dir…

A big part is how gov't money is doled out. It forces the gov't to pick winners and losers. And since politics always seems to permeate everything the gov't does, people start to question the decisions.

Even if it's something as straightforward as "green credits", the process can always be perverted to advantage one business over another.

Re: No One Saw Tesla’s Solar Roof Coming

#130

Post by ChuckMcM »

philipkglass wrote: post #22

I had serious misgivings when Tesla/SolarCity announced a switch of focus to building-integrated PV. Historically, BIPV is where a PV technology goes to die after it's failed to compete against incumbent module designs. But these have far better aesthetics than previous BIPV efforts. They look better individually and they aren't clumped in one odd shiny patch on the roof like past BIPV. Search for images of solar shi…

I think this is exactly right. There is some fudging with the cost (this seems to be a common theme with Elon) by pre-including savings and rebates Etc, but the fact is this makes a solar roof something different than a set of panels across an existing roof. The durability question, and the weight per sq foot will be interesting.

That said, the combination of the PowerWall and the roof might actually make it more amenable for power companies since you could grid tie "for emergencies" but lower your total overall power budget and help avoid the evening surge (max grid usage in the Bay Area is about 5:30PM, solar is off-line and people are coming home from work, firing up appliances (like cooking dinner, getting a beer from the fridge which turns on the converter) environment systems (heating/cooling) are activating to bring the house to the 'occupied' temperature, Etc.

If your house uses its PowerWall for all that energy you'll appear as a much smoother non-load on the grid.

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