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ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

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Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#121

Post by laksjd »

teekert wrote: post #93
Animats wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Already down 50% from the peak one week ago.

Sure it's volatile but there are truly innovating companies. Gulden for example can transfer directly to iban accounts. You can also directly get Euros from them on their own website. Shops are starting to accept Gulden locally. These are the projects to follow.

What's the point behind Gulden, though? Why do I need a cryptocurrency for anything they're doing? Do they allow anonymous gulden -> IBAN transfers? If yes, that'd be a unique feature but also one that has obvious potential for misuse and might not go down well with financial institutions and regulators.

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#122

Post by abrkn »

DennisP wrote: post #45
jbpetersen wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some attempts to plug that hole: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deniable_encryption

So there's an idea: a wallet format that lets you decrypt with any of one or more passphrases, with each passphrase giving a different set of addresses.

This is already in wide use by Trezor users. A user can have an arbitrary number of decoy wallets unlocked by the same root private key, but different passphrases.

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#123

Post by abrkn »

st3v3r wrote: post #48
seansoutpost wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Multisignature wallets mean that you can beat the credentials out of a person and still not be able to access the coins. You would have to figure out who else had keys and beat then too. Raising the difficulty a non-trivial level.

Ok, but how does that protect ME from that $5 wrench?

You can setup a hardware wallet with plausible deniability[1]

[1] https://www.reddit.com/r/TREZOR/comments/2e8a9i/can_someone_...

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#124

Post by CN7R »

A current problem that I feel blockchain-based currencies face all is the inability to effect large scale changes. Whether it be Bitcoin's infighting or Ethereum's decision to fork, the reliability of transactions by blockchains comes into question.

The central conflict is over authority: should the system be in the hands of miners or in a central power? Both of these have pros and cons.

Miners have an economic incentive to ensure changes to the system are in favor of users. And in theory, these changes are democratic: representing the opinions of the majority of miners. However, in practice, this is rarely the case; as voting power is allocated based on computing power, the result is a system governed by a few individuals with the economic resources and advantages to cheaply 'outrepresent' others. In effect, they do not represent the majority of miners and users. Look at Bitcoin, where a handful of Chinese companies control the network (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/03/business/dealbook/bitcoin-...)

A central power has the ability to enact large scale change affecting the whole system, but is inherently undemocratic. Ethereum, in response to a capital fund being hacked, performed a hard fork earlier this year, mitigating the adverse effects. This rapid collective action would be hard to do in Bitcoin.

The benefits of blockchain are anonymity, security, and low costs of transactions. Both of these features need to be upheld if blockchain-based currencies are to be competitive with current credit systems, regardless of which form of authority is adopted.

In my opinion, a central power blockchain-based currency would be preferable. Why? Current credit systems charge high fees for transactions to offload the cost of fraud and corresponding insurance. Blockchains don't, but there is no guarantee of security against hackers in a system not run by a central power. Low cost and security of transactions must be maintained. In addition, in a miner-based blockchain, all transactions are not treated equally. For Bitcoin, transactions which give a fee to miners are processed faster (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1aYfkjiN534p4zyE5WJNm...).

Any response?

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#125

Post by SilasX »

wmf wrote: post #36
mootothemax wrote: post #31

"But in ZCash, the miners only get to keep ninety percent of those coins. The rest gets dumped into accounts controlled by the ZCash company" This alone makes me extremely sceptical.

Unlike Bitcoin, where Satoshi probably mined 5% of all BTC before other people noticed? Or unlike Bitcoin, where developers get paid by layering centralized startups on top?

I don't think that's directly comparable -- he announced in advance what he was doing, and everyone had the opportunity to start mining. Getting 5% was an artifact of others not participating as much when they could have, not something written directly into the protocol.

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#126

Post by rspeer »

mappum wrote: post #101

I am long Zcash: * The founder is Zooko Wilcox-O'Hearn, creator of Zooko's triangle, the BLAKE2 hash function, Tahoe-LAFS, and former employee at MojoNation (an early attempt at cryptocurrency/P2P filesharing where another employee, Beam Cohen, went on to create Bittorrent). He knows a thing or two about decentralization/P2P. * This project is NOT a trivial Bitcoin clone with only a new proof-of-work swapped in. The…

I can't stand the proliferation of proof-of-work cryptocurrencies in a world where people don't have to pay for the externalities of the energy they use.

Let me know when there's a cryptocurrency based on proof-of-carbon-sequestration or something.

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#127

Post by 45h34jh53k4j »

lisper wrote: post #103

I'm a big believer in privacy, but anonymity scares me. Anonymity invites bad behavior: look at how bitcoin -- which isn't even all that anonymous -- has enabled the ransomware industry. I agree that it is very important for people to be able to conduct financial transactions without having to disclose them to third parties. It's also important for people to be able to use a mutually-agreed-upon trusted third party t…

we have fully anonymous, working cryptocurrencies now (monero is the best example). You cannot link transactions nor determine the balance of a public key. without the private key and transaction key no court can seize.

we have anonymous darknet markets, where you can buy many controlled substances, in visibility of law enforcement.

My point is that you can't uninvent these things. They have already changed society, and moralizing on how we shouldn't invent these things has gone way past into heavy production.

Use the technology, dont use it; this is really the only choice you can make. Their existence wont go away.

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#128

Post by 45h34jh53k4j »

jandrese wrote: post #76
wmf wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As it says in the title, it's more anonymous. So ZCash and Monero are competing for the darknet payment market.

But it can't really be truly anonymous, not if you want people to actually use it. At the end of the day you need at least some assurance that you're sending the money to the right person in exchange for their good or service. They also need to be able to verify that they have been paid for their work and by whom.

anonymous in the sense that no tx can be attributed to a particular party. it still uses strong cryptography to authenticate the transaction.

the sender and the receiver can always verify that the transaction has occurred. it wouldn't be much of a currency if it relied on anonymous rumours of payment!

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#129

Post by lisper »

45h34jh53k4j wrote: post #127
lisper wrote: post #103

I'm a big believer in privacy, but anonymity scares me. Anonymity invites bad behavior: look at how bitcoin -- which isn't even all that anonymous -- has enabled the ransomware industry. I agree that it is very important for people to be able to conduct financial transactions without having to disclose them to third parties. It's also important for people to be able to use a mutually-agreed-upon trusted third party t…

we have fully anonymous, working cryptocurrencies now (monero is the best example). You cannot link transactions nor determine the balance of a public key. without the private key and transaction key no court can seize. we have anonymous darknet markets, where you can buy many controlled substances, in visibility of law enforcement. My point is that you can't uninvent these things. They have already changed society,…

I'm not moralizing about inventing these things, I'm moralizing about using them. Inventing a nuclear weapon is not the same as using one.

BTW, I didn't know about Monero. Is there any substantive difference between it and ZCash?

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