ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency • Hacker News Board

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#11

Post by fleitz » Tue, Oct 25, 2016, 6:36 PM UTC

nickff wrote: post #9

bogomipz wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"ZCash looks like a promising tool to prevent civil forfeiture and legalized theft." How does it prevent civil forfeiture specifically? Can you elaborate?

If you carried your money electronically, the police would have nothing physical to seize. The most common form of civil forfeiture is when the police seize money or other items of value from someone transporting or holding them. More significantly, if you have an anonymous ZCash account, the state has very little idea of how much money you have, where it is, or how you've used it; this means they don't know whether…

How does it defeat the $5 wrench?

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#12

Post by nickff » Tue, Oct 25, 2016, 6:37 PM UTC

mempko wrote: post #4

We need something better than money. I don't know what that is, but I think focusing on creating new forms of tokens won't enable any radical change.

If you want to get rid of money entirely, the first thing you have to do is solve the 'Economic Calculation Problem'.[1]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_calculation_problem

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#13

Post by philfrasty » Tue, Oct 25, 2016, 6:38 PM UTC

Anyone else finds naming important for adoption? Bitcoin sounds pretty elegant to the regular Joey IMO but „ZCash“...I mean...awful. Well lets hope for a rebrand later.

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#14

Post by seansoutpost » Tue, Oct 25, 2016, 6:40 PM UTC

philfrasty wrote: post #13

Anyone else finds naming important for adoption? Bitcoin sounds pretty elegant to the regular Joey IMO but „ZCash“...I mean...awful. Well lets hope for a rebrand later.

This is the rebrand. This project was initially ZeroCoin, then ZeroCash, and now the abbreviated ZCash

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#15

Post by livingparadox » Tue, Oct 25, 2016, 6:41 PM UTC

fleitz wrote: post #11

nickff wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you carried your money electronically, the police would have nothing physical to seize. The most common form of civil forfeiture is when the police seize money or other items of value from someone transporting or holding them. More significantly, if you have an anonymous ZCash account, the state has very little idea of how much money you have, where it is, or how you've used it; this means they don't know whether…

How does it defeat the $5 wrench?

Given that the previous comment is referring to state actors, you have the courts to defeat the 5$ wrench.

For more direct criminal elements, you can make it difficult enough that its not worth them going through the effort to use the 5$ wrench and wait while you have to fetch the key. Beyond that, you're no worse off than you were versus carrying cash. The only thing electronic cards might have advantage over this is many provide fraud protection which will refund/void fraudulent charges.

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#16

Post by wh0rth » Tue, Oct 25, 2016, 6:41 PM UTC

TearsInTheRain wrote: post #10

wh0rth wrote: post #7

The blockchain is slowly going to become a dominant pillar of our transactions. Whether it be information, money, etc., blockchain will probably be a part of it. If we want it to be secure anyway...

Is anyone working on/does it make sense to have blockchain based voting for elections?

I like the idea. There's some funding waiting for that innovation

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#17

Post by nickff » Tue, Oct 25, 2016, 6:41 PM UTC

fleitz wrote: post #11

nickff wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you carried your money electronically, the police would have nothing physical to seize. The most common form of civil forfeiture is when the police seize money or other items of value from someone transporting or holding them. More significantly, if you have an anonymous ZCash account, the state has very little idea of how much money you have, where it is, or how you've used it; this means they don't know whether…

How does it defeat the $5 wrench?

It depends on what you mean by 'the $5 wrench', but anonymous cryptocurrency would allow the victim to deny or misstate their account balance. It would not protect a victim being slowly tortured to death (a situation for which I cannot imagine a protection), but would protect the victim in situations where the attacker had limited means.

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#18

Post by livingparadox » Tue, Oct 25, 2016, 6:42 PM UTC

nickff wrote: post #17

fleitz wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does it defeat the $5 wrench?

It depends on what you mean by 'the $5 wrench', but anonymous cryptocurrency would allow the victim to deny or misstate their account balance. It would not protect a victim being slowly tortured to death (a situation for which I cannot imagine a protection), but would protect the victim in situations where the attacker had limited means.

He's most likely referring to this XKCD comic: https://xkcd.com/538/

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#19

Post by seansoutpost » Tue, Oct 25, 2016, 6:43 PM UTC

fleitz wrote: post #11

nickff wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you carried your money electronically, the police would have nothing physical to seize. The most common form of civil forfeiture is when the police seize money or other items of value from someone transporting or holding them. More significantly, if you have an anonymous ZCash account, the state has very little idea of how much money you have, where it is, or how you've used it; this means they don't know whether…

How does it defeat the $5 wrench?

Multisignature wallets mean that you can beat the credentials out of a person and still not be able to access the coins. You would have to figure out who else had keys and beat then too. Raising the difficulty a non-trivial level.

Re: ZCash Will Be a Truly Anonymous Blockchain-Based Currency

#20

Post by Spivak » Tue, Oct 25, 2016, 6:43 PM UTC

bogomipz wrote: post #8

nickff wrote: post #2

ZCash looks like a promising tool to prevent civil forfeiture and legalized theft. It is interesting how the same (or similar) technologies that have made cash rare, and allowed tracking of transactions and spending, may subsequently enable radical anonymity. P.S. I hope to see an investment market based on anonymous cryptocurrency one day; it would allow many people who currently lack access to investment markets or…

"ZCash looks like a promising tool to prevent civil forfeiture and legalized theft." How does it prevent civil forfeiture specifically? Can you elaborate?

Not familiar with Zcash specifically, but it should work the same as Bitcoin. You cannot initiate a transaction without the (password protected) private key of the wallet containing BTC. If the victim of civil forfeiture refuses to provide the password and private key there is nothing that can be done to acquire the money. This is good because it changes the game from the "government takes your money and you have to sue to get it back" to "government has to prosecute to get your money in the first place".

It doesn't prevent some vague yet menacing government agent from breaking your kneecaps in order to get the password, but no security system has been able to plug that hole yet.