We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point • Hacker News Board

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#71

Post by abgawrv » Sat, Oct 22, 2016, 1:42 PM UTC

throw324159 wrote: post #49

abgawrv wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No way, that's absurd (the "help him" message, not that Assange might be in danger). First, those tweets were not posted one after another, or even in chronological order. Second, it's a mixture of missing letters and extra letters, and for example in "recipie" they select "e", when it's obviously "i" that is the extra letter. And then why take three letters from "algorithim"? And most importantly, many of these twee…

That's not true, they were posted in the last ~48 hours and Julian has been cut off since last Sunday. And only one letter is out of order. I'm not saying we should have full confidence that this is a distress message, but it deserves to raise an eyebrow and put some pressure on figuring out what has (or hasn't) become of Julian.

Really? I'm pretty sure I searched through and saw some dating back to at least October 15th, and others I kept scrolling back and couldn't even find them via a CTRL-F search. I'm not super versed in Twitter though so maybe I made a mistake, I'll have to double-check.

EDIT: Ok yeah, I definitely made a mistake about those dates. I can't find the tweet containing "recipie" at all, was it deleted? Sorry, I had no intention to mislead anyone.

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#72

Post by koolba » Sat, Oct 22, 2016, 1:54 PM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #62

koolba wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Think about a world where every country has an embassy with an Assange in it, and document dumps like we've seen are a routine weapon in information warfare. Most countries have this already. It's called the CIA or whatever the local equivalent is. The only difference is that rather than publishing directly, they leak information to media outlets for dissemination. > It's not a very nice world to imagine. The peopl…

If one really believes this, I have a very hard time understanding how they can believe dragnet surveillance is an important issue. After all, nobody is really getting hurt, except in the places where they can already get hurt just for chewing gum in public. So why not let the government search everyone's email for signs of terrorism? Why is privacy super important, one of our most fundamental rights, until some dude…

> If one really believes this, I have a very hard time understanding how they can believe dragnet surveillance is an important issue. After all, nobody is really getting hurt, except in the places where they can already get hurt just for chewing gum in public.

Why is that so hard to reconcile? You don't draw a line between individual privacy rights and those of government officials?

> So why not let the government search everyone's email for signs of terrorism?

If you're going to go that route, take it one step further and ask: Why not have a camera in everybody's house to prevent battery?

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#73

Post by tptacek » Sat, Oct 22, 2016, 1:56 PM UTC

koolba wrote: post #72

tptacek wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If one really believes this, I have a very hard time understanding how they can believe dragnet surveillance is an important issue. After all, nobody is really getting hurt, except in the places where they can already get hurt just for chewing gum in public. So why not let the government search everyone's email for signs of terrorism? Why is privacy super important, one of our most fundamental rights, until some dude…

> If one really believes this, I have a very hard time understanding how they can believe dragnet surveillance is an important issue. After all, nobody is really getting hurt, except in the places where they can already get hurt just for chewing gum in public. Why is that so hard to reconcile? You don't draw a line between individual privacy rights and those of government officials? > So why not let the government se…

What "government officials" are you talking about? Wikileaks leaked, wholesale, the personal information of millions of Turkish citizens. For that matter, in its attempt to sway the US elections, Wikileaks dumped personal emails from random staffers --- not the John Podestas of the world, but the one-step-above-intern people making $40,000 to do public service work. Not just their work-related emails. Their personal emails.

What part of taking $40,000 a year in salary from the government entitles Wikileaks to the contents of your personal emails?

http://lessig.tumblr.com/post/151983995587/on-the-wikileak-e...

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#74

Post by pmorici » Sat, Oct 22, 2016, 2:02 PM UTC

makomk wrote: post #70

pmorici wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiLeaks/comments/587lbg/i_have_be... It's looking like the latest allegations against him of pedophilia were totally false and fabricated by supporters of the Clinton campaign. Edit: the above link doesn't spell it out but the the toddandclare.com website it is talking about is allegedly a totally fake dating site that submitted a false report to the Bahamanian police and issued a fake repo…

It's not clear who fabricated the claims, but they definitely took advantage of Clinton supporters' willingness to spread dubious attacks on her enemies and their tendency to go after anyone who questions them. I mean, a dating site claiming to be UN members and that the UN is conspiring against them is way out there in nutty conspiracy-theory land, but if you look at the comments on say the Daily Kos article about t…

It's pretty clear from the Snopes article that the claims originated from the fake dating website.

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#75

Post by koolba » Sat, Oct 22, 2016, 2:12 PM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #73

koolba wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If one really believes this, I have a very hard time understanding how they can believe dragnet surveillance is an important issue. After all, nobody is really getting hurt, except in the places where they can already get hurt just for chewing gum in public. Why is that so hard to reconcile? You don't draw a line between individual privacy rights and those of government officials? > So why not let the government se…

What "government officials" are you talking about? Wikileaks leaked, wholesale, the personal information of millions of Turkish citizens. For that matter, in its attempt to sway the US elections, Wikileaks dumped personal emails from random staffers --- not the John Podestas of the world, but the one-step-above-intern people making $40,000 to do public service work. Not just their work-related emails. Their personal…

> What "government officials" are you talking about? Wikileaks leaked, wholesale, the personal information of millions of Turkish citizens. For that matter, in its attempt to sway the US elections, Wikileaks dumped personal emails from random staffers --- not the John Podestas of the world, but the one-step-above-intern people making $40,000 to do public service work. Not just their work-related emails. Their personal emails.

They didn't get the personal emails of Turkish citizens, they got the emails of Turkish citizens that were on the AKP email server. That would be like complaining that a company has access to my personal emails because I use my work email to communicate with my non-work friends. The AKP is the government in Turkey so drawing a distinction between them as a private party and them as the government is weak.

> What part of taking $40,000 a year in salary from the government entitles Wikileaks to the contents of your personal emails?

None and if you don't mix personal and work, it makes it much easier to have that separation. If it's all one soup then you can't complain that the part gets released with the whole.

> http://lessig.tumblr.com/post/151983995587/on-the-wikileak-e...

Ditto for the DNC and RNC. I don't give a rats ass which side has their documents leaked. If it happens, I say it's fair game because, even though they're technically "private organizations", for all practical purposes they are the government.

If people want to avoid having "personal" comments and communications being impacted by this they need to maintain that separation and the poster child for what NOT to do is Hillary Clinton.

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#76

Post by tptacek » Sat, Oct 22, 2016, 2:16 PM UTC

koolba wrote: post #75

tptacek wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What "government officials" are you talking about? Wikileaks leaked, wholesale, the personal information of millions of Turkish citizens. For that matter, in its attempt to sway the US elections, Wikileaks dumped personal emails from random staffers --- not the John Podestas of the world, but the one-step-above-intern people making $40,000 to do public service work. Not just their work-related emails. Their personal…

> What "government officials" are you talking about? Wikileaks leaked, wholesale, the personal information of millions of Turkish citizens. For that matter, in its attempt to sway the US elections, Wikileaks dumped personal emails from random staffers --- not the John Podestas of the world, but the one-step-above-intern people making $40,000 to do public service work. Not just their work-related emails. Their persona…

So, you disagree with Lessig. You feel, if someone gets involved in any way with politics, all bets are off. They should have Grugq-grade OPSEC or expect to read about their breakups on Pastebin.

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#77

Post by otakucode » Sat, Oct 22, 2016, 2:19 PM UTC

idlewords wrote: post #29

anondon wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what can wikileaks do that some other website can't? No fear of going against the establishment. How many websites that you know of reveal such classified information and get wide press coverage for the same? I don't fully understand Assange's political motivations, but the world is definitely better off with Wikileaks than without.

Think about a world where every country has an embassy with an Assange in it, and document dumps like we've seen are a routine weapon in information warfare. It's not a very nice world to imagine. The people who get hurt are ordinary citizens whose info winds up in these giant data drops.

Weapon? Think about a world where governments are run by representatives of the citizens using a system that is fully open to the citizens. Ability to communicate with them, for them to see every vote as it happens, and every communication between them. Both the elected and electorate seeing the same system, just with citizens having read-only access to some parts. It was impossible in the past for technical reasons, but could now happen. Spying and leaks would no longer be a weapon because the government would be open by default.

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#78

Post by koolba » Sat, Oct 22, 2016, 2:26 PM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #76

koolba wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What "government officials" are you talking about? Wikileaks leaked, wholesale, the personal information of millions of Turkish citizens. For that matter, in its attempt to sway the US elections, Wikileaks dumped personal emails from random staffers --- not the John Podestas of the world, but the one-step-above-intern people making $40,000 to do public service work. Not just their work-related emails. Their persona…

So, you disagree with Lessig. You feel, if someone gets involved in any way with politics, all bets are off. They should have Grugq-grade OPSEC or expect to read about their breakups on Pastebin.

> So, you disagree with Lessig. You feel, if someone gets involved in any way with politics, all bets are off. They should have Grugq-grade OPSEC or expect to read about their breakups on Pastebin.

Or just keep their political and personal lives separate.

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#79

Post by tnones » Sat, Oct 22, 2016, 2:34 PM UTC

jacquesm wrote: post #6

Wikileaks is apparently on a mission to destroy whatever credibility they had left. They seem to be taking a leaf out of the IS playbook here, any random attack that is moderately successful gets claimed as one of theirs. It isn't a week since they were extremely economical with the truth regarding Assange's internet access ('state actor cut off their internet' -> 'Ecuador has pulled the plug on Assange's laptop'). T…

"Wikileaks is apparently on a mission to destroy whatever credibility they had left."

It seems disingenuous to accuse them simultaneously of throwing credibility to the wind and of carefully phrasing sensitive on-going matters like the disruption of Assange's internet access.

They're also not claiming this attack "as one of theirs", they're saying a third party who supports them is _and asking them to stop_. That distinction seems pretty clear, and is not an endorsement, it's a call for de-escalation.

From where I'm sitting it's the US state machine continuing their mission to destroy Wikileaks' credibility, by misrepresenting their M.O. and cherry picking tweets like this... only now the left-wing public is eagerly joining in as opposed to only the right-wing calling for their heads for being traitors. The thing about negative associations is, it's posts like yours that create them.

But when Palin called it "palling around with terrorists", the US left-wing was rather opposed to that tactic.

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#80

Post by 1337biz » Sat, Oct 22, 2016, 2:36 PM UTC

emp_zealoth wrote: post #68

heartbreak wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They released Part 15 of Podesta's emails 20 minutes ago. If someone had whisked away Assange and taken over his Twitter account, why would they continue the huge dump of emails?

Apparently nobody gives two shits of a fuck what is in those emails, no matter how unsettling their contents are. Why not keep publishing those while you destroy Wikileaks?

It is amazing to watch this. Even if you are the most dedicated Clinton supporter there is, you have to realize how one sided media orgs across the line can become.