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We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

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Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#61

Post by skrowl »

dandare wrote: post #7
jacquesm wrote: post #6

Wikileaks is apparently on a mission to destroy whatever credibility they had left. They seem to be taking a leaf out of the IS playbook here, any random attack that is moderately successful gets claimed as one of theirs. It isn't a week since they were extremely economical with the truth regarding Assange's internet access ('state actor cut off their internet' -> 'Ecuador has pulled the plug on Assange's laptop'). T…

I absolutely agree. What Wikileaks did for peace and democracy cannot be disputed but I could not say I am their supporter any more. I wonder how much of it is Assange's personality and questionable political views and how much is of it is campaign orchestrated by almost all-powerful secret services but it probably doesn't even matter at this point.

So you only supported them when they leaked stuff about politicians you don't like?

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#62

Post by tptacek »

koolba wrote: post #52
idlewords wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Think about a world where every country has an embassy with an Assange in it, and document dumps like we've seen are a routine weapon in information warfare. It's not a very nice world to imagine. The people who get hurt are ordinary citizens whose info winds up in these giant data drops.

> Think about a world where every country has an embassy with an Assange in it, and document dumps like we've seen are a routine weapon in information warfare. Most countries have this already. It's called the CIA or whatever the local equivalent is. The only difference is that rather than publishing directly, they leak information to media outlets for dissemination. > It's not a very nice world to imagine. The peopl…

If one really believes this, I have a very hard time understanding how they can believe dragnet surveillance is an important issue. After all, nobody is really getting hurt, except in the places where they can already get hurt just for chewing gum in public. So why not let the government search everyone's email for signs of terrorism?

Why is privacy super important, one of our most fundamental rights, until some dude with white hair who wrote a bad port scanner decides it doesn't matter?

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#63

Post by tptacek »

godd2 wrote: post #42
idlewords wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Zeynep Tufekci had a pretty ruthless takedown of their indiscriminate data dump during the Turkish coup. They put thousands of ordinary citizens in danger for no reason whatsoever. The material wasn't even vetted by someone who spoke the language. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/zeynep-tufekci/wikileaks-erdog...

If they were in danger, perhaps we should blame those who were pointing guns.

What invasion of privacy can't you excuse this way? Any harm caused by a violation of privacy will always have some more proximate cause.

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#64

Post by heartbreak »

alasdair_ wrote: post #44
jacquesm wrote: post #6

Wikileaks is apparently on a mission to destroy whatever credibility they had left. They seem to be taking a leaf out of the IS playbook here, any random attack that is moderately successful gets claimed as one of theirs. It isn't a week since they were extremely economical with the truth regarding Assange's internet access ('state actor cut off their internet' -> 'Ecuador has pulled the plug on Assange's laptop'). T…

There is something really weird going on with the wikileaks twitter right now. Lots of odd posts, lots of misspellings, lots of links to things like Politico that they never linked to before. WAY more partisan than before. This all started the day Equador cut off his net access. Assange has not been seen in public since. How hard would it be for them to post a five second video clip with today's newspaper? Current th…

They released Part 15 of Podesta's emails 20 minutes ago. If someone had whisked away Assange and taken over his Twitter account, why would they continue the huge dump of emails?

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#65

Post by [deleted] »

pmorici wrote: post #38
anondon wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If what Assange and team are going through is any indication, the US Government has set a dangerous precedent in how it deals with people who go against the establishment, exposing it. They spin a narrative saying he broke certain laws, which is true, but doesn't explain how hard they are hitting Assange with behind the scenes activities to extradite him to the USA. The real motivation is to get back at Assange for p…

https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiLeaks/comments/587lbg/i_have_be... It's looking like the latest allegations against him of pedophilia were totally false and fabricated by supporters of the Clinton campaign. Edit: the above link doesn't spell it out but the the toddandclare.com website it is talking about is allegedly a totally fake dating site that submitted a false report to the Bahamanian police and issued a fake repo…

[deleted]

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#66

Post by dirtshell »

skrowl wrote: post #61
dandare wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I absolutely agree. What Wikileaks did for peace and democracy cannot be disputed but I could not say I am their supporter any more. I wonder how much of it is Assange's personality and questionable political views and how much is of it is campaign orchestrated by almost all-powerful secret services but it probably doesn't even matter at this point.

So you only supported them when they leaked stuff about politicians you don't like?

When they acted as a pass through for leaks and supported govt.transparency. Now its pretty clearly a partisan attack on dems with the min focus of profiting and keeping wikileaks generating cash (check out their store, which used to never be a thing, if you don't believe me).

The first set of large leaks wikileaks ever did were simply dumps. Now they spoonfeed their leaks, which they claim everyone has a right to know, at a peace that is most beneficial to them. Its clear their primary objective is no longer govt transparency, but their own profits.

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#67

Post by striking »

alasdair_ wrote: post #44
jacquesm wrote: post #6

Wikileaks is apparently on a mission to destroy whatever credibility they had left. They seem to be taking a leaf out of the IS playbook here, any random attack that is moderately successful gets claimed as one of theirs. It isn't a week since they were extremely economical with the truth regarding Assange's internet access ('state actor cut off their internet' -> 'Ecuador has pulled the plug on Assange's laptop'). T…

There is something really weird going on with the wikileaks twitter right now. Lots of odd posts, lots of misspellings, lots of links to things like Politico that they never linked to before. WAY more partisan than before. This all started the day Equador cut off his net access. Assange has not been seen in public since. How hard would it be for them to post a five second video clip with today's newspaper? Current th…

I mean, if Assange doesn't have access to the internet, this might not be him tweeting. It could be someone tweeting on his behalf, really poorly.

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#68

Post by emp_zealoth »

heartbreak wrote: post #64
alasdair_ wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is something really weird going on with the wikileaks twitter right now. Lots of odd posts, lots of misspellings, lots of links to things like Politico that they never linked to before. WAY more partisan than before. This all started the day Equador cut off his net access. Assange has not been seen in public since. How hard would it be for them to post a five second video clip with today's newspaper? Current th…

They released Part 15 of Podesta's emails 20 minutes ago. If someone had whisked away Assange and taken over his Twitter account, why would they continue the huge dump of emails?

Apparently nobody gives two shits of a fuck what is in those emails, no matter how unsettling their contents are. Why not keep publishing those while you destroy Wikileaks?

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#69

Post by analog31 »

Gargoyle wrote: post #21
jacquesm wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wikileaks only coin was trust, they've lost that as far as I can see therefore their time of usefulness is more or less over. I really don't see how they will regain it at this point, sometimes a fresh start is better.

None of their releases have been discredited. Focusing on personalities is a mistake.

Indeed, personalities don't matter. To make an analogy, there are scientists whose personalities, and even political views, turn me off. But what matters is whether they do credible science.

If it's just somebody's hobby to release information, than that's as far as it goes. But in order for the information to be actionable, it requires interpretation, and then the process of choosing what information to release becomes important.

Imagine how a hypothetical scientist's results would be interpreted if it were known that they were only publishing the information that favored their own agenda -- personal, political, commercial, etc. Yet none of the data points that they publish can be discredited.

Re: We ask supporters to stop taking down the US internet. You proved your point

#70

Post by makomk »

pmorici wrote: post #38
anondon wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If what Assange and team are going through is any indication, the US Government has set a dangerous precedent in how it deals with people who go against the establishment, exposing it. They spin a narrative saying he broke certain laws, which is true, but doesn't explain how hard they are hitting Assange with behind the scenes activities to extradite him to the USA. The real motivation is to get back at Assange for p…

https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiLeaks/comments/587lbg/i_have_be... It's looking like the latest allegations against him of pedophilia were totally false and fabricated by supporters of the Clinton campaign. Edit: the above link doesn't spell it out but the the toddandclare.com website it is talking about is allegedly a totally fake dating site that submitted a false report to the Bahamanian police and issued a fake repo…

It's not clear who fabricated the claims, but they definitely took advantage of Clinton supporters' willingness to spread dubious attacks on her enemies and their tendency to go after anyone who questions them. I mean, a dating site claiming to be UN members and that the UN is conspiring against them is way out there in nutty conspiracy-theory land, but if you look at the comments on say the Daily Kos article about this people didn't just go along with their claims, they even accused people questioning them on places like Twitter of all kinds of nasty things.
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