All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware • Hacker News Board

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#601

Post by freehunter » Thu, Oct 20, 2016, 3:00 PM UTC

rsync wrote: post #551

scraft wrote: post #475

Interesting for two reasons: 1. It is a self driving car, it is so clearly the future, I wish it existed now, it is going to be awesome (in my opinion). 2. Despite knowing about and following news about driverless cars for a while, there was something surprisingly (to me) compelling about watching the video. It's like you get a little taste of the full A to B that it can give you (door to door). Who wants to speculat…

"It is a self driving car, it is so clearly the future, I wish it existed now, it is going to be awesome (in my opinion)." Even now, several years into the current news/development arc of self-driving cars, I still can't believe this is going to be the future. We're really never going to european (or japanese) style train networks ? We're really going to keep binging on roads ? We, as a nation of fat slobs [1] are re…

Cars changed the world. There's not really any going back from that. It works in places where the urban population is over 90% (like Japan) but not when urban population is substantially lower (like the US). How would the rural population get to the bus/train station? My grandma's house is half an hour by car to the nearest freeway, how long would she have to walk to get to public transport?

Public transport only works inside of cities, and there's a lot of infrastructure already built to support sprawling metropolitan areas where everyone has 1/4 acre of land surrounding their detached home. There's not a lot of push to tear all that up and forcibly relocate the residents to inner-city apartments.

You know the benefit of electric, self-driving cars, though? An intelligent car isn't going to run you over on your bike. Be happy about that.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#602

Post by S_A_P » Thu, Oct 20, 2016, 3:01 PM UTC

brianwawok wrote: post #580

esquevin wrote: post #565

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What'd you do if you drove over mud and it covered your windshield ?

This I would guess: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxDEqkAWbPE&t=40

Upvoted! Im not sure the battery pack would allow General Lee style antics, so I guess a model S cant be used for a Dukes of Hazzard Redux...

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#603

Post by hipshaker » Thu, Oct 20, 2016, 3:01 PM UTC

S_A_P wrote: post #537

So what do these cars do when the hit a puddle of mud and it covers all the cameras. Will there be a new form of vandalism where someone puts scotch tape over/destroys the vehicles cameras and now your fancy autonomous vehicle is rendered incapacitated. Maybe this seems unlikely or ridiculous, but the dependence on cameras at points on the car that seem likely to get dirty and or damaged seems to be a risk to me.

Yeah and so what?!

Good on you for being risk averse. Bad for all of us if you were in charge.

Risk will always be a factor when trying to push the envelope and bring new tech to life.

It's easy to put down most ideas on the basis of some risk - cars, rockets, medicine...

You have to build something and then you will discover how to improve on that eventually.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#604

Post by ythl » Thu, Oct 20, 2016, 3:01 PM UTC

rwmj wrote: post #530

donohoe wrote: post #448

So, lets be clear then, you do not truly own the car. Am reminded of ebook and movie purchases - you're only just licensing the item. You own next to nothing.

Not having to own a car, maintain it, repair it, etc is a feature, not a bug. I'd far rather have a pay-for-use car (ie. a driverless taxi).

I don't like the idea of "sharing" upholstered seats with other people. I'm very neat and tidy, and other people aren't. Other people are going to eat their chips and junk in the car and get crumbs everywhere...

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#605

Post by aub3bhat » Thu, Oct 20, 2016, 3:01 PM UTC

rsync wrote: post #551

scraft wrote: post #475

Interesting for two reasons: 1. It is a self driving car, it is so clearly the future, I wish it existed now, it is going to be awesome (in my opinion). 2. Despite knowing about and following news about driverless cars for a while, there was something surprisingly (to me) compelling about watching the video. It's like you get a little taste of the full A to B that it can give you (door to door). Who wants to speculat…

"It is a self driving car, it is so clearly the future, I wish it existed now, it is going to be awesome (in my opinion)." Even now, several years into the current news/development arc of self-driving cars, I still can't believe this is going to be the future. We're really never going to european (or japanese) style train networks ? We're really going to keep binging on roads ? We, as a nation of fat slobs [1] are re…

train networks and subways are significantly more expensive to build, operate and maintain, even electrified ones. Roads + autonomous electric cars are hard to beat in terms of efficiency, utility and ease of operation.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#606

Post by freehunter » Thu, Oct 20, 2016, 3:01 PM UTC

dyarosla wrote: post #576

georgespencer wrote: post #543

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are problems which are actually improved as more cars move to autonomous driving. A sensible government would mandate that manufacturers must upload anonymised data about each car in real time, which would effectively allow for cross-talk between cars. This could enable automatic remedies to the above situations (car X tells car Y "I've got more room behind me, let me reverse), but also prevent them in the firs…

I see this pro cross-talk argument all the time... but wouldn't that leave open a big vulnerability for bad actors to send false data between cars and, if they should choose to, control multiple vehicles and cause collisions?

Also traffic would grind to a halt if the power went out on that block.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#607

Post by Swizec » Thu, Oct 20, 2016, 3:02 PM UTC

rsync wrote: post #551

scraft wrote: post #475

Interesting for two reasons: 1. It is a self driving car, it is so clearly the future, I wish it existed now, it is going to be awesome (in my opinion). 2. Despite knowing about and following news about driverless cars for a while, there was something surprisingly (to me) compelling about watching the video. It's like you get a little taste of the full A to B that it can give you (door to door). Who wants to speculat…

"It is a self driving car, it is so clearly the future, I wish it existed now, it is going to be awesome (in my opinion)." Even now, several years into the current news/development arc of self-driving cars, I still can't believe this is going to be the future. We're really never going to european (or japanese) style train networks ? We're really going to keep binging on roads ? We, as a nation of fat slobs [1] are re…

There is hope. More and more young urbanites in dense cities are already eschewing car ownership for walking and on-demand rentals. Even European-style public transit can only be so convenient[1], and a fleet of selfdriving ubers would be perfect. I hope that this will mean even fewer people decide to own cars and that car ownership becomes increasingly uncommon.

[1] public transit is great for when you have a lot of time and aren't carrying a lot of things. Doing, say, your weekly groceries by bus or walking is annoying af. Source: living in a European city without owning a car.

PS: I live in the US now and not having a car is much more convenient than it was in Europe. Uber and zipcar and getaround are magic. We didn't have that in my city

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#608

Post by robotresearcher » Thu, Oct 20, 2016, 3:02 PM UTC

dyarosla wrote: post #576

georgespencer wrote: post #543

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are problems which are actually improved as more cars move to autonomous driving. A sensible government would mandate that manufacturers must upload anonymised data about each car in real time, which would effectively allow for cross-talk between cars. This could enable automatic remedies to the above situations (car X tells car Y "I've got more room behind me, let me reverse), but also prevent them in the firs…

I see this pro cross-talk argument all the time... but wouldn't that leave open a big vulnerability for bad actors to send false data between cars and, if they should choose to, control multiple vehicles and cause collisions?

Yes. So should we not do it? Maybe the benefits outweigh the risks. Like almost every engineering decision ever, it's a trade off.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#609

Post by leecb » Thu, Oct 20, 2016, 3:02 PM UTC

dyarosla wrote: post #576

georgespencer wrote: post #543

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are problems which are actually improved as more cars move to autonomous driving. A sensible government would mandate that manufacturers must upload anonymised data about each car in real time, which would effectively allow for cross-talk between cars. This could enable automatic remedies to the above situations (car X tells car Y "I've got more room behind me, let me reverse), but also prevent them in the firs…

I see this pro cross-talk argument all the time... but wouldn't that leave open a big vulnerability for bad actors to send false data between cars and, if they should choose to, control multiple vehicles and cause collisions?

If cars upload their data, as well as data about other cars detected in their environment (e.g. positions of other detected cars), we could detect the suppliers of false or incorrect data by comparing data from multiple cars in each situation. It's not perfect, but could be a step in the right direction.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#610

Post by BWStearns » Thu, Oct 20, 2016, 3:02 PM UTC

georgespencer wrote: post #543

jgrahamc wrote: post #494

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd like to see a self-driving car navigate London's narrow streets with cars both sides and the negotiation that goes on between drivers about who goes first. I'm impressed with this self-driving on California's spacious streets in perfect weather. I'll be really impressed when I see a self-driving car go down a London street in pouring rain, realize it needs to allow someone to come from the other direction and rev…

These are problems which are actually improved as more cars move to autonomous driving. A sensible government would mandate that manufacturers must upload anonymised data about each car in real time, which would effectively allow for cross-talk between cars. This could enable automatic remedies to the above situations (car X tells car Y "I've got more room behind me, let me reverse), but also prevent them in the firs…

Why make it centralized? I generally am suspicious of "anonymized" datasets (in the abstract) as any usable data is probably enough to nonymize someone given a couple other pieces of data. Forgive me if you didn't mean a centralized system but I took upload and anonymize to suggest that.

In the case of cars some radio comms (uhf, wifi, or even bluetooth?) is probably sufficient since there is no reason for a car in New York cares about the opinions of a car in San Francisco. You'd probably even see performance gains under a distributed system since latency is effectively taken out of the equation (time of flight for local radio being effectively instantaneous).