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Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds

bloomberg.com

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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds

#371

Post by coldtea »

pc86 wrote: post #138
coldtea wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How happy are they working that extra 25%? They are richer, sure. But I don't think being rich is an indicator of your overall state. They aren't that richer either -- if anything the majority is less rich in standard of living than most western European and nordic countries. Getting some more money in your salary is not worth much if you have to give most of it to medical coverage and basic services.

> the majority is less rich in standard of living than most western European and nordic countries Blatantly false (see the other comment re: GDP). With a few exceptions[0], the US is very close to the top in terms of overall standard of living. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nomi...

First of all, GDP and GDP per capita != standard of living.

Even regarding GDP per capita, most the "few exceptions" you mention that trump the US are western European and nordic countries with the exception of #4 Qatar.

  1      Luxembourg	102,717
  2	 Switzerland	80,603
  3	 Norway	74,598
  5	 Ireland	61,206

  6	 United States	56,084
And don't think that a 10% change in GDP per capita (like e.g. from USA to Sweden) means much in terms of standards of living -- there's the distribution of this GDP, the organization of everyday life, work standards, state services, etc.

Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds

#372

Post by _benedict »

jdmichal wrote: post #331
_benedict wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem to be missing the majority of my point, but I agree it's an arbitrary distinction as a technicality. However, 32 US states do declare English as their official language. That's certainly more homogenous than the EU, the original point of contention. Just 2 of 28 EU states declare their official national language as English, and only one of these has English as their only official language (indeed, only the U…

In the Brexit threads, it was discussed that the EU language selection is not really representative of populous or culture. Each country could only select one, and multiple entries didn't add anything. So many countries who may have potentially selected English didn't, because it was already selected by another country and it would be a "wasted" selection. For instance, Ireland has more English speakers than Irish sp…

Your definition of "many" may need a revisit - this is simply not common. Ireland is the only egregious case, and I covered that in my comment. The Maltese population really does speak Maltese, as well as English. Every other language I can see in the official EU list is genuinely a primary tongue of one the nations in the EU.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_the_European_Unio...

Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds

#373

Post by lagadu »

endisukaj wrote: post #217
RandomName2020 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's harder to move from a class to another compared to the US. Not true: social mobility in US is lower than in Europe and Canada.

> Not true: social mobility in US is lower than in Europe and Canada. I can't speak about Canada but I seriously doubt that social mobility is higher in Europe. Again, you can't generalize. It may be far easier to move from a class to another in Germany than for example Italy or France.

Probably harder but social class in Europe is mostly unrelated to wealth, while in the US the two are closely knit, which is what is often measured.

Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds

#374

Post by lagadu »

adwn wrote: post #87
ajmurmann wrote: post #32

I find it astonishing how positive Bloomberg tries to spin this: People earn a wider range of incomes in the U.S., so “workers have an incentive to try harder to move up the job ladder because a promotion is worth more,” said Dora Gicheva -The income range in the US is so large that there are lots of people at the bottom end who have to work multiple jobs. How much does that have to do with the longer work hours, Blo…

> I find it astonishing how positive Bloomberg tries to spin this Reminds me of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNzXze5Yza8

Dear god, the concept that someone thought this was a good commercial is almost breathtaking.

Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds

#375

Post by wott »

Symbiote wrote: post #202
ajmurmann wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does that actually apply to every field? I've only worked briefly as a software developer in Germany and not full time, but I never got the impression that unions would realistically stop anyone in that field from working till midnight. If you are working as a factory worker for example that's of course a totally different story. However, I doubt that people in that kind of job regularly decide to put in a few extra…

It's the EU Working Time directive. You can work longer for yourself, but not for someone else. http://ec.europa.eu/social/main.jsp?catId=706&langId=en&intP...

But is not applied for everyone. In my country, it doesn't apply to engineers typically: the only limit is 13h/day, 6days/week, so that's a "limit" of 78h/week...

Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds

#376

Post by wott »

jupiter90000 wrote: post #292
matrix_escape wrote: post #168

I think its a lot more than 25%. In Sweden where I work, people are relaxed at their jobs. Coming in at 8.30 am and leaving at 4.30 pm with a full lunch break in the middle is normal. Taking a couple of coffee breaks or ping pong matches and chatting with collegues is normal. There is casual talk all day long and bosses are also leaving work early to pick up children, spend time with the family and just enjoy their l…

This is just an anecdote though. I work in the US and can come in after 10am and leave by 4pm if I want. I can work remote when I want to and have done this for a week out of state and just random weekdays. This is all on a 40hr salary that hasn't been cut. I bring my dog to work and go to lunch when I want to. I shoot the breeze with coworkers when I want to. We still get our work done. There are some times when I w…

> This is just an anecdote though.

No, it is not. The guy is telling about a generic situation. And I can tell it goes the same way in Finland too.

Yours is an anecdote though. You know pretty well your case is not common.

Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds

#377

Post by touristtam »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #302
ido wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having to wait a much longer time till waiters acknowledge you in the German-speaking countries is certainly a bigger part of it than the smiling or lack there of.

Is that just "design" of the culture though? If you're working 20% less of the time you've more time to relax; perhaps then you don't need to stress if you've a little more time to chat before your strudel arrives. Personally I hate it when you've only just sat down and the waiter is asking what you want, especially if it's a big menu and you've arrived at a meal time.

And I hate when you have to wait 20 min for the "garcon de cafee" to even notice you have finished and want the bill.

Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds

#378

Post by lagadu »

ythl wrote: post #174
sguav wrote: post #165

I struggle to digest this article. Considering I'm an Italian who has ever worked 40+ hours a week (non tech jobs got me to 60+ hours/wk...). And then, when I lived in England, everyone seemed to be doing at most 35 hrs/wk. I understand that these are statistics, but I can't really match it to my experience (but, hey, maybe this tells me to complain less and enjoy spare time more!)

Italians have the opposite problem - too much spare time (at least, all at once). When I lived in Italy I was astonished that the entire country could effectively shut down for an entire month (ferragosto). I mean, come on, at least stagger your vacations so that everyone doesn't take leave all at the same time...

That's true for pretty much most of Europe, in my experience; though as you move further north it's during July instead of August. The most common here in Denmark is the last three weeks of July.

I really like working in July, the whole city is empty and nobody bothers me because they're on vacation :)

Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds

#379

Post by misiti3780 »

henrikschroder wrote: post #344
misiti3780 wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry for this small rant .... I dont understand why everyone is so caught up with answering emails on vacation. Yes - it's not ideal, but as long as your not expected to be on your phone all day, and in my experience, you are not unless you own your own business, are a doctor, etc. then what is the big deal? 5/10 minutes of email's in the morning means Europeans have a better work/life balance ? If you work for a sm…

To properly recharge during vacation, to get rid of work stress, and actually return to work energized, you need to disconnect from work. This means you have to do absolutely nothing that's connected to work for at least three weeks straight. Shorter vacations spoil this. Emailing or talking on the phone while on vacation spoils this. Quick question: Have you ever taken three consecutive weeks off work?

not since college. im 34

Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds

#380

Post by jinglebells »

wil421 wrote: post #301
snovv_crash wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't seen any US companies offering 25 days of paid vacation a year, plus unlimited sick leave (doctors note required for more than 3 consecutive days), plus extra days off for personal emergencies eg children sick, death in family. All the money in SV could never make me go there if I never have time to spend it.

A quick google search and I can't find many places in Europe that offer 25 days, not including the national holidays. If I include national holidays I get 22 days off. No set sick days unless you're out for more than 5 consecutive days. I'm not sure why you'd move to SV, startup life's seems like hell.

6 weeks holiday in UK, Germany and Sweden is fairly normal. I don't know about the other countries.
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