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Feds Walk into a Building and Demand Everyone's Fingerprints to Open Phones

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11–20 of 190 posts

Re: Feds Walk into a Building and Demand Everyone's Fingerprints to Open Phones

#11
post #6
post #4

Not a fan of solely using fingerprints for authentication. Good systems allow you to rotate keys. I only got 10 fingerprints.

And you might not have any, once an adversary is done with you.

Fortunately, my threat model does not include people cutting off my fingers. Take out the pliers and you can have my phone. My notes are private, but not that private.

Re: Feds Walk into a Building and Demand Everyone's Fingerprints to Open Phones

#12
I have to wonder what sort of technical measures could be implemented to make biometric systems as legally secure as passwords while still retaining something like the same convenience.

The first thing that comes to mind for me is the Apple patent on recognizing a fingerprint anywhere on the phone's surface, and using that in combination with Android-style lock screen patterns. A lock screen pattern isn't nearly as secure as a full password, but it could serve a similar legal role.

Re: Feds Walk into a Building and Demand Everyone's Fingerprints to Open Phones

#13
post #10

This is why my unlock is not tied to biometrics. Once I realized the government can compel you to unlock your phone without a warrant using your fingerprint it became a much less compelling feature. The same for facial recognition.

Yep. I got into a little argument with my brother over this last week, as he is a "I don't care, I have nothing to hide."

Re: Feds Walk into a Building and Demand Everyone's Fingerprints to Open Phones

#14

I have to wonder what sort of technical measures could be implemented to make biometric systems as legally secure as passwords while still retaining something like the same convenience. The first thing that comes to mind for me is the Apple patent on recognizing a fingerprint anywhere on the phone's surface, and using that in combination with Android-style lock screen patterns. A lock screen pattern isn't nearly as s…

It has to be speech, since speech is protected. How about 'phrase of the day' to be spoken in conjunction with swipe?

[p.s. this should be relatively trivial to roll out in a patch by Apple.]

Re: Feds Walk into a Building and Demand Everyone's Fingerprints to Open Phones

#15
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And you might not have any, once an adversary is done with you.

Fortunately, my threat model does not include people cutting off my fingers. Take out the pliers and you can have my phone. My notes are private, but not that private.

https://www.xkcd.com/538/

Re: Feds Walk into a Building and Demand Everyone's Fingerprints to Open Phones

#16
post #2

Just another reason to forgo the convenience of biometrics in favor of a password/phrase that exists only in your mind. At least for now, that's something you can't be compelled to produce. Really though, this descent into a police state is such a pathetic outcome for this country. Dangerous, scary, and tragic, but also... pathetic. This is what happens when a sizeable majority don't even participate in the electoral…

Biometrics could be used as a username, but should not be used as a password...

Re: Feds Walk into a Building and Demand Everyone's Fingerprints to Open Phones

#17
post #13
post #10

This is why my unlock is not tied to biometrics. Once I realized the government can compel you to unlock your phone without a warrant using your fingerprint it became a much less compelling feature. The same for facial recognition.

Yep. I got into a little argument with my brother over this last week, as he is a "I don't care, I have nothing to hide."

My favorite fast response to disarm that is always: that's not up to you [whether or not you have something to hide]. I've found it instantly shakes the false comfort they're trying to derive from their premise and opens up a moment of rethink.

Re: Feds Walk into a Building and Demand Everyone's Fingerprints to Open Phones

#18
post #7
post #2

Just another reason to forgo the convenience of biometrics in favor of a password/phrase that exists only in your mind. At least for now, that's something you can't be compelled to produce. Really though, this descent into a police state is such a pathetic outcome for this country. Dangerous, scary, and tragic, but also... pathetic. This is what happens when a sizeable majority don't even participate in the electoral…

A sizable majority would go along with this, because they haven't been come for yet, as the saying goes.

To use another saying, the frogs in this pot are just about boiled... if not now, it's going to be too late, if it isn't already.

Re: Feds Walk into a Building and Demand Everyone's Fingerprints to Open Phones

#19
In the legal filing, the government says (in a footnote) that there is no Fifth Amendment issue because the Fifth protects against self-incrimination but that, here, no one has been charged with a crime.

The government is on a "fishing expedition" -- obtaining a warrant to search the phones so that they can (hopefully) find evidence. As mentioned in the article, it doesn't work that way (they're going about it backwards).

Re: Feds Walk into a Building and Demand Everyone's Fingerprints to Open Phones

#20

I have to wonder what sort of technical measures could be implemented to make biometric systems as legally secure as passwords while still retaining something like the same convenience. The first thing that comes to mind for me is the Apple patent on recognizing a fingerprint anywhere on the phone's surface, and using that in combination with Android-style lock screen patterns. A lock screen pattern isn't nearly as s…

The linked article states that a "voice print" would likely be sufficient (but hasn't been tested legally).
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