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The Problem with Modern Romance Is Too Much Choice

nautil.us

61–70 of 131 posts

Re: The Problem with Modern Romance Is Too Much Choice

#61

I think most men have opposite experience. Only a celebrity can choose from hundreds of potential mates. It is almost impossible to find a good partner for starting a family (healthy, bellow 26, no debt, family values).

> healthy, bellow 26, no debt, family values

That is me. But I also have pretty much no money to fund the "family values" :P

Re: The Problem with Modern Romance Is Too Much Choice

#62
post #14

I'm just going to preface this by saying I'm a fairly physically unattractive man (short, Asian, assymetrical face with no strong jawline). The quality of the women (based on intellect, personality, accomplishments, and appearance) who I've met in real life first before dating have been vastly superior to the women who I managed to find a date with through online dating. Besides the restrictiveness of the online dati…

The other problem I've noticed is that most women don't have a problem finding a date. They can go to a bar, club, library, grocery store and men ask them out. Why do they need to go online in the first place? They are either too picky or have some other major issue. Before I was married, I found dates online all the time. 99% of the women I dated had issues or were too picky. I didn't end up finding my wife until I…

> had issues or were too picky

This seems rather vague and subjective...

Re: The Problem with Modern Romance Is Too Much Choice

#63
This is the key passage of the article that pretty much says it.

In short, if you're faced with 30 jars of jam to choose from, you'll narrow by brand or GMO-status or whatever. Facing a choice for a mate in a list of 1,000 people, you filter by height, race, tits, or some other attribute.

Your outcome will be the same (ie. you'll have jam in your toast or a person in your life), but the criteria different.

> When Benjamin Scheibehenne, a professor of cognition and consumer behavior at the University of Geneva, set out to replicate the jam study, he found no evidence that people were less satisfied with their choices when they had a larger array to select from. “It seems to be fairly difficult to overload or confuse or frustrate people just based on the number of options,” Scheibehenne says. “In most situations, people are quite good at coping.” He points out that if abundant choice were really as paralyzing as Schwartz and others have proposed, people would constantly get stymied in everyday situations like deciding which shirt to wear or what to have for lunch.

> Instead, Scheibehenne argues that people generally avoid being overwhelmed by practicing a kind of quick-and-dirty mental judo, using some kind of shortcut to limit their choices—whether that means giving certain factors more weight or simply skipping some of the presented choices.

Re: The Problem with Modern Romance Is Too Much Choice

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's another thing society does that heavily penalizes "unattractive" men: Men are strongly stigmatized for wearing make-up for personal (as opposed to professional) use. It really isn't fair. A good foundation and some concealer goes a long way. I don't think attractiveness matters past initiating the first date in a cold relationship. Who knows, is it because I've gotten older? Getting to know someone makes their…

I'm guessing this isn't so much the case in other cultures as I had a few male Korean friends who wore light make up.

Oh, of course. It even changes with time within the same culture. In the United States at least, away from major cities with a strong culture of liberal individuality, there are extreme social pressures culminating in even violence that police the conduct of both men and women when it comes to self-expression through makeup and fashion.

Re: The Problem with Modern Romance Is Too Much Choice

#65
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really about what's written??? 90% is visual is it not? How is it for you ... if you don't find her attractive as im sure you look at her pics first.. are you going to bother reading what her profile says?

Do people judge on looks, of course but women less so. How a profile is written can absolutely make a difference. It is your personality translated in to words.

From what I've seen, women judge more on looks than men, but what they find attractive is far more diverse than men. OKCupid has some interesting data [1] supporting this. When you consider that most relationships form between people of a similar age, it follows that the man is compromising more on looks.

[1] http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/christian-rudder-datacly...

Re: The Problem with Modern Romance Is Too Much Choice

#66
post #14

I'm just going to preface this by saying I'm a fairly physically unattractive man (short, Asian, assymetrical face with no strong jawline). The quality of the women (based on intellect, personality, accomplishments, and appearance) who I've met in real life first before dating have been vastly superior to the women who I managed to find a date with through online dating. Besides the restrictiveness of the online dati…

Here's another thing society does that heavily penalizes "unattractive" men: Men are strongly stigmatized for wearing make-up for personal (as opposed to professional) use. It really isn't fair. A good foundation and some concealer goes a long way. I don't think attractiveness matters past initiating the first date in a cold relationship. Who knows, is it because I've gotten older? Getting to know someone makes their…

Attractiveness overall seems a more valued trait in women, though, to a rather catastrophic degree. I think men should be allowed to use makeup, and I think the small amounts that would help others wouldn't notice, but, overall, I don't think the fact that women are supposed to constantly worry about their makeup or their hair or their fashion so disproportionately is an advantage. I got the impression that men don't wear makeup mostly because it doesn't really matter. That's a lot of time better spent doing almost literally anything else.

Re: The Problem with Modern Romance Is Too Much Choice

#67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you make a strict distinction between hooking up and dating, everything starts to make sense. Hooking up stats are rather clear: around 80% of women have sex with around 20% of men. That's why an average looking guy on PoF/CL/Tinder/OkCupid has very little chance compared to real life. This imbalance is actually caused by the guys. Your average guy will throw himself at almost any woman. You join a site, you go…

Hooking up stats are rather clear: around 80% of women have sex with around 20% of men. That's why an average looking guy on PoF/CL/Tinder/OkCupid has very little chance compared to real life. While I think this sounds very true, do you have a reference? It completely matches the experience in the city I live in, and I'd love to be able to quote it to people.

Sorry, speaking from my experience. And probably most guys experience. Everyone who has been to highschool can see it.

OKCupid has some research, but they don't record actual sex encounters. They have stats like "As you can see from the gray line, women rate an incredible 80% of guys as worse-looking than medium".

Re: The Problem with Modern Romance Is Too Much Choice

#68
post #14

I'm just going to preface this by saying I'm a fairly physically unattractive man (short, Asian, assymetrical face with no strong jawline). The quality of the women (based on intellect, personality, accomplishments, and appearance) who I've met in real life first before dating have been vastly superior to the women who I managed to find a date with through online dating. Besides the restrictiveness of the online dati…

The other problem I've noticed is that most women don't have a problem finding a date. They can go to a bar, club, library, grocery store and men ask them out. Why do they need to go online in the first place? They are either too picky or have some other major issue. Before I was married, I found dates online all the time. 99% of the women I dated had issues or were too picky. I didn't end up finding my wife until I…

Not wanting to date some random people that approach you in public spaces is being "too picky"? Might as well say that having any preference is too picky. By that definition, I'm yet to make a friend that isn't "too picky" or does not have a "major issue".

Re: The Problem with Modern Romance Is Too Much Choice

#69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Below 26 is your killer. Statistically, people marry later than before, and women are more educated (both 'than before' and 'than men'). Women have more career opportunities than before, so why would they want to marry at 26 (or sub-26, as you put it). That kills their opportunities for careers and post-collegiate education. Family values? That's one specific to your region of the country (I'm in a less pious part of…

People have wacky expectations and want to wait to have more money, more experience, more whatever. Most of my primary circle of friends married between 23-26, which was awesome for us because we met people we knew better. People who marry later struggle more, both with finding the right person who wants to be married, but still isn't and other issues. Whatever gains you make in working go away quickly with a few IVF…

I mean, it's great if you had that kind of network of friends at 23-26 and you found the right person, but what if you didn't? I doubt people are purposefully rejecting perfectly good mates because they're arbitrarily waiting longer. Meeting new people is just not that easy for many of us.

Re: The Problem with Modern Romance Is Too Much Choice

#70
post #37

I'm into polyamory, I'm also rather alternative looking (mowhawk, piercings). These things filter >99% of the people out, but most of them aren't of my interest in the first place. Globally I have lesser choice, locally it works out pretty good for me, at least at the moment.

I'm nominally polyamorous as well. I haven't tried to maintain multiple relationships at a time (one is already so hard!) but I prefer to date people with polyamorous tendencies. It makes dating and commitment so much easier and all of my romantic relationships have translated into intimate friendships when they ended. I find that polyamory is a good proxy for flexibility and a more deliberate attitude towards cultiv…

My longest relationships were poly. I have to go to specific places (offline meetups and online communities) but in my experience it's a viable way to structure ones love life :)
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