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Lost Diamonds: How our current system is failing underprivileged talent

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Re: Lost Diamonds: How our current system is failing underprivileged talent

#161

Post by Jtsummers »

ap22213 wrote: post #146
hueving wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, I should have been stricter with my phrasing. There is no place on earth where you can consider yourself middle class only having $24m in net worth. What you are referring to is likely a small community filled with people with net worths above $100m, but that doesn't change the class level because of what I pointed out. If you can quit your job and make 6 figures off of interest, you are not middle class anymo…

I get what you're saying - but the reality is that globalization is to blame. Years ago, if one was born ambitious and able, with enough luck they'd get relatively 'rich' and most likely stop when they hit that point. Nowadays, the same type of person has to accumulate a much larger amount to feel any satisfaction. And, it doesn't help that those with wealth have clustered together.

Can you give us a hint as to where this place is? I believe that you believe this, and it may be true, but the rest of us are having a hard time figuring out where this place is that the upper class is half a billion dollars, and tens of millions only makes you middle class. Again, within a city or perhaps some particularly small but remarkably wealthy country, maybe. But which one?

Re: Lost Diamonds: How our current system is failing underprivileged talent

#162

Post by hammock »

trjordan wrote: post #3

I wish I could remember where I read this, but I once heard it explained to me as this: It's easy to deride the journey of the rich college student: 80-hour internships at Goldman Sachs, unpaid positions in government, etc. But, the things that are done by successful people are hard, as hard as walking a tightrope. The difference is that rich students walk this tightrope over a bed of pillows. Poor students walk it o…

>Paradoxically, if you know you have more than one shot, you're more likely to succeed on your first try.

True and I'll give an example of a technique I use (which is somewhat common) when recording vocalists in the studio.

The singer will get in the booth and I'll ask them to sing a run-through. Even say "we're not recording this one." But of course we are recording. And many times it's this rehearsal take that ends up being the best one.

Re: Lost Diamonds: How our current system is failing underprivileged talent

#163

Post by marme »

jedmeyers wrote: post #147
trjordan wrote: post #3

I wish I could remember where I read this, but I once heard it explained to me as this: It's easy to deride the journey of the rich college student: 80-hour internships at Goldman Sachs, unpaid positions in government, etc. But, the things that are done by successful people are hard, as hard as walking a tightrope. The difference is that rich students walk this tightrope over a bed of pillows. Poor students walk it o…

At what point does one have to start to be considered independently successful? - You inherited a lot of wealth and a CTO position at a father's company - Parents gave you money and bought you stuff - Parents gave you a place to live - At least you had one parent - Being an orphan, at least you were born in a first-world country - At least you were born at all, thanks to the medical care in a third world country So,…

FYI the first wheels were wooden, it is common misconception that the wheel was invented in the stone age. Human civilization invented farming and pottery many centuries before the invention of the wheel

Re: Lost Diamonds: How our current system is failing underprivileged talent

#164

Post by ap22213 »

mikestew wrote: post #138
ap22213 wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're not alone - trust me. Most people don't believe me. But, then, I grew up in a place where many if not most household incomes are less than $15k / year. It's all relative though - I have enough saved up to probably live as a rich man in probably 99% of the earth. Yet, I keep pushing myself to get into the upper class of a minuscule area of the world. It's kind of screwed up.

You're not alone - trust me. Most people don't believe me. It might help if you actually stated where you live. As it stands, you're talking about your girlfriend who "goes to a different school". Which school, and what's her name?

Loudoun county, which is ranked as the highest income county in the US.

Re: Lost Diamonds: How our current system is failing underprivileged talent

#165

Post by filoeleven »

ethbro wrote: post #17
trjordan wrote: post #3

I wish I could remember where I read this, but I once heard it explained to me as this: It's easy to deride the journey of the rich college student: 80-hour internships at Goldman Sachs, unpaid positions in government, etc. But, the things that are done by successful people are hard, as hard as walking a tightrope. The difference is that rich students walk this tightrope over a bed of pillows. Poor students walk it o…

Family money also buys practice. As someone who grew up middle class surrounded by people above me on the social strata, the amount of activities wealthy kids get to train for life's challenges are mind boggling. When anyone on HN sat down to their first big interview, ask yourself what practice you had with applicable social skills? (Business culture, dress, and social norms, etc.) Now substitute someone who's never…

Not to mention the additional networking opportunities provided by growing up in that environment. Even absent more formal networking events, your chances of someone at a barbecue saying "oh, you're doing X? I have a friend at BigCompany, give me your resume and I'll pass it along" are much better than someone not in that class.

Re: Lost Diamonds: How our current system is failing underprivileged talent

#166

Post by tptacek »

dsacco wrote: post #149
tptacek wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I believe they are. Prosecutors try to spend their time on the cases they can win. You don't even have to be criminally charged to see how farcical the system is: just go to traffic court sometime and watch how the system handles people with lawyers.

Speaking as someone who has never gone to traffic court, can you tell me how the system handles people with lawyers versus people without lawyers?

We answered this on crypto nerd Slack but I'll repeat for the benefit of the class:

In Cook County, at least, you're given a time to appear in court. Everyone appears at that time. Cases are handled in alphabetical order. But: if you have a lawyer, your case is handled first --- the lawyers are on the clock, you see --- so there's about an hour and a half of waiting for lawyer after lawyer to come up and get their clients cases dismissed, while everyone else sits doing nothing.

Re: Lost Diamonds: How our current system is failing underprivileged talent

#167

Post by NotSammyHagar »

mikestew wrote: post #138
ap22213 wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're not alone - trust me. Most people don't believe me. But, then, I grew up in a place where many if not most household incomes are less than $15k / year. It's all relative though - I have enough saved up to probably live as a rich man in probably 99% of the earth. Yet, I keep pushing myself to get into the upper class of a minuscule area of the world. It's kind of screwed up.

You're not alone - trust me. Most people don't believe me. It might help if you actually stated where you live. As it stands, you're talking about your girlfriend who "goes to a different school". Which school, and what's her name?

I can't reply to ap22213 for some reason, but I agree with everyone else - people are not middle class in Loudon County unless they have more than 25 million. That's clearly wrong, you don't understand what middle class means. Your next door neighbors might all have a billion, and your 15 million feels like not much, but that doesn't make you middle class, you are still rich.

In Seattle, there's this area where a bunch of billionaires live on Lake Washington. If you live next door in your 5 million dollar house to bill gates, that doesn't make you middle class. It just makes you poorer than he is.

Re: Lost Diamonds: How our current system is failing underprivileged talent

#168

Post by kamaal »

simplemath wrote: post #78
mixmastamyk wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, now you can forgive yourself and be proud of what you've accomplished and will continue to.

Internalized fear of abandonment, shame, and undervaluing of self-worth... Takes years of work to undo, even after you've made it. My story is similar to the parent comment - not as severe, but close. I'm doing well now, but I suffer deeply from impostor syndrome and am constantly waiting to be fired, or cast out or sent back to the bread line, even though, rationally, I know that these are not likely, or even possib…

I feel like this all the time.

I feel like I'm always having one last chance at anything life and it will be curtains should I fail, despite knowing fairly well such a thing might never come to pass.

Re: Lost Diamonds: How our current system is failing underprivileged talent

#169

Post by EdSharkey »

tajen wrote: post #73

I'm in France and I sometimes notice that USA articles focus only on underpriviledged talent . Why only the talents? It's a bit like rape is fought against, except in prisons because they're lower-grade citizen. Or like articles describing unwarranted violence from the SWAT teams: "The family was playing poker, they got busted for illegal gaming, 3 died" will trigger fewer reaction than "The SWAT team killed the dog.…

I guess I'm an old fashioned US citizen and resist your sentiment. I'm of the opinion that if you grab a random adult, inspect them, ask them about their lives, look at their health, abilities, check out their finances, family, and all the rest - then you'll come to the conclusion that, for the vast majority, they themselves are best able to take care of themselves.

"Our civilization needs to take care of everyone" is simply impossible when there's a disaster and people are on their own. If our opening bid is "we (civilization) will take care of you, ", then I believe we set people up to be helpless when they are stranded. It's presupposed weakness.

Conversely, when people have freedom to make their own choices on how they conduct their lives, those self-support muscles and brains are strengthened. It's agency, it's people power.

What is a challenge for me with this philosophy is, how should we then help legitimately disadvantaged, sick, threatened people in society to survive and thrive if we assume most people can take care of themselves? At the bottom, obviously there are street urchins who are not cute and do need saving.

Perhaps the social safety net needs to be retooled to apply the most intense resources at the very bottom and then trail off rapidly such that resources are not spread too thin. This might focus the drive of capable, healthy individuals to take care of themselves as government service offerings would supply an uncomfortable/barely tolerable living.

People in real dire straits, like the homeless, need the most resources in my opinion. Homelessness should be declared illegal so that civil liberties aren't an issue when we force these people to work or become wards of the state if they are not capable.

I don't understand the freedom arguments in favor of the homeless; I would argue purely from a public health standpoint we (civilization) have the right force these people out of their predicament.

Re: Lost Diamonds: How our current system is failing underprivileged talent

#170

Post by monocasa »

ap22213 wrote: post #164
mikestew wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're not alone - trust me. Most people don't believe me. It might help if you actually stated where you live. As it stands, you're talking about your girlfriend who "goes to a different school". Which school, and what's her name?

Loudoun county, which is ranked as the highest income county in the US.

According to this, middle class in Loudoun county is ~$150K household income.

http://www.loudountimes.com/news/article/the_loudouns_at_122...

Looking at Zillow, it's cheaper than where I live (Boulder, CO).

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