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Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

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Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#521

Post by hinkley »

A number of years ago, around or shortly after the time I read the Mars Trilogy, I remember seeing an article about how the three largest populations of high altitude humans (Peru, Nepal, Ethiopia) all use a different biological process to deal with the effects of hypoxia.

The lower the pressure, the safer the structure, so one imagines you could have a colony where many of the workers from these three population groups, nature taking its course and we end up with legitimate Martians. People who could live in cheap structures or deep canyons with no suits for generations before the rest of us.

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#522

Post by elsonrodriguez »

goatlover wrote: post #286
40acres wrote: post #267

Elon mentioned that there is no physical frontier left to explore on Earth, what about deep water exploration?

If exploration is the goal, wouldn't you get a lot more bang for your buck with a swarm of robots and probes around and on Mars? Sending people is very expensive in contrast.

Reading a NOAA report about Hawaii's weather is much cheaper than going there, yet people still go.

A total waste, I say.

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#523

Post by elevensies »

Grishnakh wrote: post #498
elevensies wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The goal is to maximize re-use in order to minimize cost, for a tanker to fuel a tanker in orbit you'd need two tankers. So 1 booster + 1 transporter + 1 tanker, vs. 1 booster + 1 transporter + 2 tankers. If the trip takes 100 days, adding 3 weeks is 20% longer, and you might get it 20% cheaper by saving one spacecraft ... I can see it going either way.

Why not just save a bunch of time and use new boosters? Then reuse those boosters for other missions? Reusing rockets is great for saving money, but that doesn't mean you need to reuse the same rocket for this one mission; if you have a business going with, say, 30 missions over the next year, you're probably going to need a lot more than one booster in stock anyway. Or, instead of new boosters, use a bunch of reused…

With only one tanker, you can launch the tanker first and then launch the transporter, so it isn't any faster than launching a tanker and transporter simultaneously.

To go any faster you'd need more tankers as well. I don't forsee the tanker having commercial value short-term, so this would still increase the cost. With two tankers though, you can just have a full tanker waiting in orbit which is the fastest possibility, so there is no need of extra boosters in that case.

I agree with the premise of multiple boosters though. I wonder if a spacecraft could be made that could do both commercial earth orbit satellite missions, and serve as a tanker. This could finance a larger number of tankers. I think you'd need a 3rd stage on top of the tanker in this case to get the satellite in position. [EDIT: I mean either carry the extra fuel, or carry a 3rd stage + satellite, not both at the same time.]

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#524

Post by hyperion2010 »

banach wrote: post #500

The SpaceXes of the age of colonization, such as the East India Company, used to sell shares to fund their voyages. I was a bit surprised not to hear Musk mention this as a funding option, since he just delivered the greatest Kickstarter pitch of all time...

The various * Companies weren't exactly going into uninhabited areas, they were calling at ports that had been involved in global sea trade for many centuries albeit at a slightly lower volume. Despite this there were still a series of disastrous bubbles due to speculation on the various * Companies [0].

0. https://ericrossacademic.wordpress.com/2015/10/18/mapping-th...

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#525

Post by slg »

__jal wrote: post #180
slg wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that is taking an overly optimistic view of the past. No other time in history has it been easier or cheaper to pick up your life and move and the truth is that almost anywhere in the "west" provides better living conditions and less persecution than anyone from even a few generations back could hope to receive.

I think you're forgetting that there are dreamers, crazies and malcontents that historically have been more than willing to risk everything to make a go somewhere new or get away from their civilized peers. Persecution is certainly one motivator, but hardly the only one. Some people are driven to explore, some are religious nuts looking for whatever they look for, some just hate civilization or people or their family…

Just because there are people willing to risk more doesn't change the fact that you can do almost the same thing today and risk less. All most westerners would need is a few thousand dollars, a passport, and a few weeks time and they can make it to almost any land in the world. There might not be any free land to claim and start your own country, but even in the US there are still large swaths of ungoverned land that an off the grid type could set up to live their life in peace with little interference from civilization.

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#527

Post by [deleted] »

kolinko wrote: post #354
benevol wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would never say "it won't work", but I do think we humans have a tendency to turn to technology to solve our most basic problems, while the real solutions lie within us (where most people never look). I believe we should first learn to clean up our act on planet Earth before we export anything of our existence and what we do. To me, the real revolution that needs to happen is a spiritual one - a statement that will…

Meditation can go hand in hand with space exploration. Besides that, Musk is doing two things at the same time. He tries both to protect the earth (Tesla, solar power), and initiate a base in case something happened to our home. Spirituality alone won't help you survive winter, regardless of how developed your mind is.

[deleted]

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#528

Post by redditmigrant »

anexprogrammer wrote: post #473
mikeash wrote: post #148

Some of the comments here make me think of crabs in a pot pulling down the ones who try to climb out. Nobody's making you participate in this venture. If you don't like it, then you're free to go do whatever it is you do like. You might think Musk could better direct his efforts and resources elsewhere, but most other billionaires don't do anything all that interesting, they just invest their money in mundane stuff,…

We need a lot more like Musk, whether you agree with space or not. Investing their resources in crazy ideas of their heart, some might just work. We don't progress the species with digging up more rocks, building more stuff, selling more stuff, or dare I say it, finding a new way to get a cab. A few more vastly wealthy eccentrics building teams to play with space, fusion (carefully I hope), generation, or whatever pi…

>We don't progress the species with digging up more rocks, building more stuff, selling more stuff, or dare I say it, finding a new way to get a cab.

I think you are assuming that being wealthy is just a state someone gets into magically.

While the things you mention aren't on their own crazy species changing ideas, the selling stuff, the getting a cab is what allowed some folks to become wealthy and go after crazy things. So don't discount the process of acquiring resources.

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#529

Post by lettergram »

jdietrich wrote: post #481
benevol wrote: post #392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Spirituality alone won't help you survive winter, regardless of how developed your mind is. It's funny that you would say that - you may want to take a quick look at this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6XKcsm3dKs (The main site is: http://www.icemanwimhof.com/ )

There is no good scientific evidence that Hof's breathing techniques account for his ability to withstand cold temperatures, rather than some kind of genetic difference. Four people have died while attempting to follow his 'technique'. http://www.parool.nl/binnenland/-iceman-oefening-eist-opnieu...

On a related note, you might find this story about a frozen guru who is still "meditating" after several years of attempting to withstand the cold...

http://loweringthebar.net/2016/09/frozen-guru-update-iii.htm...

Re: Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species [video]

#530

Post by nixos »

ChampCrawDaddy wrote: post #502
nixos wrote: post #472

Did he talk about the future land ownership/governmentship of his colony? Will it be a personal dictatorship of Elon? Unlike Earth, once you're there, there's nowhere to go without his blessing. You can't just "move next door". And knowing how "locked down" his Tesla cars are, it'll be interesting to see how he'll deal with a rebellious colony.

Hey if you pay for the research and development, equipment, transportation, construction, and deal with the myriad of other problems that come with living on another planet I'm sure you'd be free to make your own rules. You make it sound like Elon owes us something already.

He doesn't.

But that doesn't mean that I'm comfortable with potential dictatorships like that.

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