Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Microsoft is using Minecraft to vie for kids’ brain space and schools’ dollars

backchannel.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–89 of 89 posts

Re: Microsoft is using Minecraft to vie for kids’ brain space and schools’ dollars

#81

Post by ocdtrekkie »

wmf wrote: post #68
thr0waway1239 wrote: post #4

Considering Chromebooks barely entered the market only about 4 years back. "In 2015, Chromebooks topped 50 percent of personal computer sales in the U.S. K-12 education market for the first time, with Windows PCs trailing at 22 percent, according to a Futuresource Consulting report." And looking at the chart in the report [1] is even stranger - Chromebooks have basically gone from 16% of yearly device sales to 50% of…

Even though the numbers are pretty misleading, there are a couple interesting things in them. Presumably iOS had almost no market share in K-12 in 2009 (pre-iPad), yet it took 39% share by 2013. Then Chromebooks took that share and more. Maybe once a market gets disrupted there is an opening for another player to re-disrupt it since customers haven't had time to grow too attached.

My understanding is very few schools had a plan for making iPads effective classroom devices when they bought them. So for many, the attachment was zero.

But the other thing is, I don't think you're seeing a "disruption" of an existing market. In 2009 and before, nobody would ever have conceived of the insanity of buying one computer for every student. I think this is closer to a new market than anything else. Because neither iPads nor Chromebooks really infringe on the sorts of purchases most schools' IT purchases were prior: Computer labs and office PCs, which are likely predominantly still Windows. (And oddly excluded from these numbers.)

Re: Microsoft is using Minecraft to vie for kids’ brain space and schools’ dollars

#82

Post by projektir »

rocky1138 wrote: post #3

If you're a developer looking to fight this, I'd suggest taking a look at Minetest, which started out as a fully libre open-source clone of Minecraft but has really grown into its own project in its own right. The core engine is C++ and mods are programmed using Lua. http://www.minetest.net/#about

That's actually pretty amazing... given all the weird problems with modding Java Minecraft I wish the community would switch to something like this instead.

Re: Microsoft is using Minecraft to vie for kids’ brain space and schools’ dollars

#83

Post by jtrtoo »

shmerl wrote: post #72
fixermark wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're seeing familiarity with open source tools as an end. If the goal of education is to teach people fundamentals of computer use that are independent of software, the use of open source in that equation is orthogonal to the goal. It's easier to just use what everyone else is using. I think the "it" some "get" is not seen as a necessary "it" for the purposes of education, and "Using closed stuff for educat…

> "Using closed stuff for education is a bad idea" is begging the question. It's quite clear that depending on some vendor who can dictate what to do for the education system is a bad idea. And entities like MS clearly have that power now to some degree (or strive to gain that power). So using open source in education field is a natural way to avoid that. As I said, some actually get it enough to act on it. I don't t…

How does using open source actually avoid that?

Isn't all software opinion, regardless of origin?

Re: Microsoft is using Minecraft to vie for kids’ brain space and schools’ dollars

#84

Post by int_19h »

gdulli wrote: post #26
Haul4ss wrote: post #5

When Apple makes an iPad app to teach kids a programming language useful only in the Apple ecosystem, they're promoting STEM education. When Microsoft leverages a massively popular game to promote STEM education, they're weaponizing.

HN definitely has this bias and it's not a place to expect reasonable discussion of Microsoft, but if you look at the actual headline of the article instead of the submitted one the use of "weaponize" has more context and makes sense: "Microsoft Weaponizes Minecraft in the War over Classrooms"

I wouldn't say HN has strong anti-MS bias, based on some of discussions that I've seen and participated in here - and I'm a Microsoft employee.

In my experience, flames get to be downvoted pretty quickly, allowing for rational discussion, and providing an opportunity to to be heard, and present rebuttals and counterpoints.

Then again, I also hang out on Slashdot, so my baseline may different from yours...

Re: Microsoft is using Minecraft to vie for kids’ brain space and schools’ dollars

#85

Post by Gaelan »

badlogic wrote: post #74
qwertyuiop924 wrote: post #36

Weaponize? That's just wrong. Minecraft, retroactively dubbed Minecraft Java Edition, is totally cross platform. So, how does this new product help MS dominate education? Answer: it doesn't. It's like arguing that Bröderbund (I hope I spelled that right) weaponized Zoombinis to take over the education market.

Minecraft Education Edition is a fork of Minecraft Pocket Edition, written in C++ without modding capabilities and only compatible with Windows 10. Minecraft Java Edition is likely going to die eventually.

MC:Ed runs on Macs as well. More details of Minecraft's codebases:

Minecraft at this point has 3 separate codebases: the original one written in Java, the "Pocket Edition" codebase, and the console codebase.

The Java edition was the "original" Minecraft codebase. It runs on most versions of macOS, Windows and Linux. Because it is written in Java, it is very easily moddable and has a large modding scene. Most features arrive here first.

The console port was developed by 4J Studios in C++ and released in 2012 for the Xbox 360. It now runs on most game consoles.

Mojang separately released an iOS/Android port in 2012, known as Minecraft Pocket Edition. This port is also written in C++. The PE codebase was ported to Windows 10 as well (W10 can run the Java version as well).

Back to MC:Ed. MC:Ed is a spiritual successor to a third-party product, MinecraftEdu (Java Edition licensed from Mojang, modded to be suitable for education). Microsoft bought the company behind MinecraftEdu and is replacing it with MC:Ed, which is based on the PE codebase and runs on Windows 10 and macOS (El Cap+).

Re: Microsoft is using Minecraft to vie for kids’ brain space and schools’ dollars

#86

Post by qwertyuiop924 »

Gaelan wrote: post #85
badlogic wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Minecraft Education Edition is a fork of Minecraft Pocket Edition, written in C++ without modding capabilities and only compatible with Windows 10. Minecraft Java Edition is likely going to die eventually.

MC:Ed runs on Macs as well. More details of Minecraft's codebases: Minecraft at this point has 3 separate codebases: the original one written in Java, the "Pocket Edition" codebase, and the console codebase. The Java edition was the "original" Minecraft codebase. It runs on most versions of macOS, Windows and Linux. Because it is written in Java, it is very easily moddable and has a large modding scene. Most features…

I don't know why they did that. "Hey guys, let's replace an already well-known product with a more limited version with less features. That will sell us a ton of copies!"

Re: Microsoft is using Minecraft to vie for kids’ brain space and schools’ dollars

#87

Post by [deleted] »

Gaelan wrote: post #85
badlogic wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Minecraft Education Edition is a fork of Minecraft Pocket Edition, written in C++ without modding capabilities and only compatible with Windows 10. Minecraft Java Edition is likely going to die eventually.

MC:Ed runs on Macs as well. More details of Minecraft's codebases: Minecraft at this point has 3 separate codebases: the original one written in Java, the "Pocket Edition" codebase, and the console codebase. The Java edition was the "original" Minecraft codebase. It runs on most versions of macOS, Windows and Linux. Because it is written in Java, it is very easily moddable and has a large modding scene. Most features…

[deleted]

Re: Microsoft is using Minecraft to vie for kids’ brain space and schools’ dollars

#88

Post by Gaelan »

qwertyuiop924 wrote: post #86
Gaelan wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MC:Ed runs on Macs as well. More details of Minecraft's codebases: Minecraft at this point has 3 separate codebases: the original one written in Java, the "Pocket Edition" codebase, and the console codebase. The Java edition was the "original" Minecraft codebase. It runs on most versions of macOS, Windows and Linux. Because it is written in Java, it is very easily moddable and has a large modding scene. Most features…

I don't know why they did that. "Hey guys, let's replace an already well-known product with a more limited version with less features. That will sell us a ton of copies!"

The C++ codebase was originally written because Java didn't run on iOS. In fact, MC:PE has sold more copies than the desktop version. Not sure about MC:W10, probably a desire to unite under one codebase.

Re: Microsoft is using Minecraft to vie for kids’ brain space and schools’ dollars

#89

Post by qwertyuiop924 »

Gaelan wrote: post #88
qwertyuiop924 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know why they did that. "Hey guys, let's replace an already well-known product with a more limited version with less features. That will sell us a ton of copies!"

The C++ codebase was originally written because Java didn't run on iOS. In fact, MC:PE has sold more copies than the desktop version. Not sure about MC:W10, probably a desire to unite under one codebase.

I know why the C++ codebase was written, but MC:W10 doesn't make sense, and neither does MCED moving off MCJE.
Post reply on HN