Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

nytimes.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 265 posts

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#31

Post by jlarocco »

ben_jones wrote: post #23

Disclaimer: The following are existential questions that do not reflect my own beliefs in any way, shape, or form. Why do older people deserve jobs? Why does anyone deserve a job? Are there instances where we as a society accept people NOT deserving a job? How different is age as an attribute compared to: Felons, the mentally impaired, the under-qualified, those lacking physical attributes?

> How different is age as an attribute compared to: Felons, the mentally impaired, the under-qualified, those lacking physical attributes?

For that question to work you need to explain why age would disqualify somebody.

A felon has committed a serious crime in the past, demonstrating they may be unsafe or untrustworthy.

A mentally impaired person may not be able to think things through and solve problems that come up in day-to-day work.

By definition, an under-qualified person can't do the job.

A person lacking a physical attribute may literally not be able to perform the required tasks.

There is nothing like that directly associated with growing old. In fact, experience is a big positive, and that actually increases with age, which should make older people more desirable than younger ones.

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#32

Post by ishbits »

rawnlq wrote: post #16
dijit wrote: post #2

I don't see many old sysadmins in companies I've worked in. Even fewer older developers, I have a slight worry that this career path has an affinity for youth- which I won't have for much longer. So this is disheartening to read.

People working in tech also tend to retire early or start doing their own thing due to their salary.

This probably only applies to various pockets like Silicon Valley or New York. For the most part, developer salaries aren't that great.

I'd be much better off had I become an accountant, or perhaps even a plumber running my own business.

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#33

Post by jpindar »

RachelF wrote: post #7
aswanson wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tech fields have an inherent disuse for seniority. Beyond five years, no one gives an f how long you have worked with a given toolchain/language. It's the hunger games. Medicine, finance, law, accounting...rightly or wrongly respect decades of experience. Tech is Logan's Run. Plan accordingly.

Also younger workers are lot cheaper and don't have families, so you can work them longer hours. Older techies have wised up.

And you've bought right into the ageism.

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#34

Post by ourmandave »

hirundo wrote: post #8

I'm a grey beard who applied to a company specifically advertising for young developers. Got the job without mentioning my vintage. That was six years ago and they still haven't seen my face. I waited a while to gently break the news to them. If you're a technological senior citizen remote work is your friend.

Ah, "Grey beard". The term Microsoft used to separate the old from the young at a conference when they first introduced the .NET framework. Classic "old bad, good new" sales.

As in, "you Grey Breads remember using C++ and MFC, etc."

Yes I remember. Because it was yesterday just before I came to your conference!

I still went home and started learning what the hell XML was though. =(

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#35

Post by teuobk »

hirundo wrote: post #8

I'm a grey beard who applied to a company specifically advertising for young developers. Got the job without mentioning my vintage. That was six years ago and they still haven't seen my face. I waited a while to gently break the news to them. If you're a technological senior citizen remote work is your friend.

How did they "specifically advertise for young developers" without running afoul of age discrimination laws?

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#36

Post by FLUX-YOU »

ardit33 wrote: post #14
cpprototypes wrote: post #9

Recently I got an email about a job that seemed interesting. It's a well known company that used to be a startup but is now a mature company. I went to the job description page: 8+ years experience, tech stack I'm familiar with, mostly backend work, seems ok so far. Then I get to the last line. Open office, has video games, happy hours, other typical things designed to attract those in their 20s. It's all a hidden me…

I am sorry, but what is wrong with having video games in the office? At both my previous companies I played games time to time, with co-workers. 15 mins of playing Fifa with a co-worker end s up both relaxing, and productive as you both bond and hash out things, and often much better than boring meeting. I am 35 btw. Also, our CEO regularly played as well. I have been at an office/environment (Amazon), with cubicles,…

No idea. In fact, having some complicated games to learn and compete at is likely a good thing if you have a team of gamers and give your brain a mental break from work while still having something interesting to chew on. Think high level play in fighting games/MOBAs, number crunching in MMOs, FPS map strategies, car simulation builds, sports strategies and teams, etc.

Even if you don't want to think about that stuff, you can then turn to doing silly things and giving yourself a break.

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#37

Post by erichurkman »

JadeNB wrote: post #18
RottenHuman wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how do you work for someone without them knowing your age? Do you keep that out of your CV? How about credentials and signing your contact? Seems very strange to me.

> Do you keep that out of your CV? My understanding is that it is not only possible not to mention your age in your CV, but even illegal for companies to ask you what your age is as part of the application process.

Putting your age isn't necessary when your experience goes back decades and you graduated from university before your hiring manager was even born. Similarly, your name can convey a lot of biases as well, such as gender and ethnicity.

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#38

Post by jlarocco »

RottenHuman wrote: post #11
hirundo wrote: post #8

I'm a grey beard who applied to a company specifically advertising for young developers. Got the job without mentioning my vintage. That was six years ago and they still haven't seen my face. I waited a while to gently break the news to them. If you're a technological senior citizen remote work is your friend.

how do you work for someone without them knowing your age? Do you keep that out of your CV? How about credentials and signing your contact? Seems very strange to me.

Your age or birth date probably shouldn't be on your CV. Unless you think it's relevant to the job somehow, but it probably isn't.

Not only should it not matter, but it's illegal for employers to ask about it or consider it in their hiring decision, so having it right there on your CV puts them in a bit of a tight spot. I think some recruiters will actually remove that type of thing before forwarding it on to the interviewers and hiring people.

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#39

Post by reddytowns »

ryanSrich wrote: post #24
ardit33 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am sorry, but what is wrong with having video games in the office? At both my previous companies I played games time to time, with co-workers. 15 mins of playing Fifa with a co-worker end s up both relaxing, and productive as you both bond and hash out things, and often much better than boring meeting. I am 35 btw. Also, our CEO regularly played as well. I have been at an office/environment (Amazon), with cubicles,…

It's not the video games themselves. It's the culture. It's a way to keep young employees in the office longer. It's not uncommon for these places to have people roll in around 10am and stay until 10pm. That's not a place I want to work at, and I'm not even 30 yet. But you can bet your life savings on a company firing anyone for not playing this game. That's why I won't work for a place with videogames.

Wait, they fire people for not playing videogames?

Re: You’re How Old? We’ll Be in Touch

#40

Post by newjersey »

ourmandave wrote: post #34
hirundo wrote: post #8

I'm a grey beard who applied to a company specifically advertising for young developers. Got the job without mentioning my vintage. That was six years ago and they still haven't seen my face. I waited a while to gently break the news to them. If you're a technological senior citizen remote work is your friend.

Ah, "Grey beard". The term Microsoft used to separate the old from the young at a conference when they first introduced the .NET framework. Classic "old bad, good new" sales. As in, "you Grey Breads remember using C++ and MFC, etc." Yes I remember. Because it was yesterday just before I came to your conference! I still went home and started learning what the hell XML was though. =(

I still can't wrap my head around the fact that we have developers who work on .NET and have never touched either WinForms or WebForms.

And I am relatively young.

Post reply on HN