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PowerShell is open sourced and is available on Linux

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Re: PowerShell is open sourced and is available on Linux

#251

Post by daveloyall »

Klathmon wrote: post #171
philsnow wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> With text you just read and parse, while with objects you need to know the object type, its fields parsing is actually a huge pain in general. a lot of unixy tools produce different output when their stdout is not a terminal to be more pipeline-friendly. That output is generally easier to parse (often tab-separated or so), but you still need to know the same things about the output (the "type" could be whether it c…

I wrote a bash script to sort processes by age on an old redhat 4 machine. What sounded like a very simple thing, quickly ended up being a complete nightmare of bash, python, and an unholy bunch of linux commands. It was ugly, and a terrible way of doing it, but we got it working. It would have been amazing if i could pipe PS into something that could sort by the dates on the 4th column, and return the last column in…

Pretty sure the section in the `ps` man page called OBSOLETE SORT KEYS indicates that even the `ps` on very old redhat machines could do this out of box... see the field `start_time`.

Failing that, consider the `etimes` field (seconds since process was started) used in conjunction with the -o feature (control output format) so you can put `etimes` up front then simple pipe the output to `sort`.

Those things being said, the situation you describe is indeed hairy. `ps` output was designed for human consumption, that's why the process age field format varies (1w vs 10:15) and that's presumably why you wanted to bring python into the mix!

...You might have had an easier time looking in /proc...

Indeed, this looks promising:

    cat /proc/[0-9]*/stat|sort -n|less -S
EDIT: hm, I don't know how old /proc is!

EDIT #2: But try doing ANY of this on an ancient Windows machine! The "peer" of your old Redhat machine would be what, a Win2k3 machine, or a Win2k? How old is PowerShell? :)

Re: PowerShell is open sourced and is available on Linux

#252

Post by qwertyuiop924 »

djsumdog wrote: post #108
amenod wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this really so useful in practice? I have never used PowerShell before (nor do I have plans to do so in the near future), but I would imagine the downside is complexity, both for user and especially for developers. With text you just read and parse, while with objects you need to know the object type, its fields,... Whatever happend, I hope text stays here (and I have a bad feeling about it ever since I met system…

I've done some Powershell work in my brief time as a Windows sys-admin. I personally struggled with it. The object interaction can be complex and the naming feels less scriptable and more directly out of the C# world. That being said, I can see the appeal and I know people who love it. I have seen some amazing shit written in it, like this security tool that was just open sourced this year: https://github.com/adaptiv…

Python and ruby for the big stuff, bash and the Holy Trinity (sed, grep, and find) for the small stuff. AWK for anything in between.

Re: PowerShell is open sourced and is available on Linux

#253

Post by daveloyall »

qwertyuiop924 wrote: post #246
daveloyall wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine trying? Sir/Ma'am, I have done so. When boxed in-between the fearsome foursome--`bash`, `sed`, `awk`, and `emacs`--every problem involving tabular data (2D) is trivial. Hm, I'll give a shout-out to `sort` and `uniq`, too! When you go 3D, you might need to bring in `join`. But anyway, you'd use find ~/bin /usr/bin -mtime 1 -executable -type f -ls ..to provide `ls -la` output for every executable, ordinary file…

Hey, don't forget cut and xargs!

    *gulp* I've heard people say that, but I haven't delved into them!!  :-S

Re: PowerShell is open sourced and is available on Linux

#254

Post by codemac »

qwertyuiop924 wrote: post #238
codemac wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want to throw my support behind scsh! It's useful for those things that cross the boundaries between a program, and a shell script. I've found once you need functions for a shell program, it's time to step up to scsh. I also wish scsh ports were more well maintained so people could use their favorite schemes with scsh syntax, but it's quite a large codebase to port, so remember that it's scheme48 scheme.

bits of SCSH have been ported to every scheme out there now. And some have been improved. Irregex, in particular, is a dramatically improved version of the SCSH regex engine.

Oh yes, ashinn's irregex is so good, I just include it in my home directory.

Re: PowerShell is open sourced and is available on Linux

#256

Post by ksk »

amenod wrote: post #32
Analemma_ wrote: post #6

PowerShell is my guilty pleasure of the computing world. Once you've piped strongly-typed objects around between your shell commands, text scraping seems barbaric by comparison. The problem, of course, is that you can't use all that power for much, since the pool of PS-compatible tools and utilities is much shallower than it is for Unix shells. I'm really hoping this will help spur a new wave of PowerShell-compatible…

Is this really so useful in practice? I have never used PowerShell before (nor do I have plans to do so in the near future), but I would imagine the downside is complexity, both for user and especially for developers. With text you just read and parse, while with objects you need to know the object type, its fields,... Whatever happend, I hope text stays here (and I have a bad feeling about it ever since I met system…

Could you elaborate on what the actual complexity is, rather than what you imagine?

For a developer writing a tool, exposing an interface as objects is far easier than having to constantly serialize data into a string. Keep in mind that once you serialize data into a string, you can never change the order of the data or else other tools will break. Not so with a object based interface.

In other system-admin type tasks PowerShell hides complexity. For e.g. finding the IP address of a network interface is simply

  Get-NetIPAddress | select IPAddress
compared to something horrendous like

  ifconfig | perl -nle 's/dr:(\S+)/print $1/e'

Re: PowerShell is open sourced and is available on Linux

#257

Post by vicda »

wvenable wrote: post #69
Analemma_ wrote: post #6

PowerShell is my guilty pleasure of the computing world. Once you've piped strongly-typed objects around between your shell commands, text scraping seems barbaric by comparison. The problem, of course, is that you can't use all that power for much, since the pool of PS-compatible tools and utilities is much shallower than it is for Unix shells. I'm really hoping this will help spur a new wave of PowerShell-compatible…

I love the strongly-typed cookies but I absolutely hate the powershell syntax. It's like C# and Bash got together and had a really ugly baby.

Yeah, it's a mixture of Perl and Bash with sudden C# calls interspersed.

Re: PowerShell is open sourced and is available on Linux

#258

Post by Jtsummers »

__derek__ wrote: post #211
Jtsummers wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Last IronPython release: 2014 Last IronRuby release: 2011

I can't speak to Ruby, but Microsoft has an active Python group.[1] Granted, it seems to focus on Visual Studio (which I'm told has excellent Python tooling) and Azure. [1]: https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/pythonengineering/

Neat, but that doesn't seem to be integrated into .NET like IronPython was (well, is, just not maintained it seems). Which is what the post I was responding to was talking about.

Re: PowerShell is open sourced and is available on Linux

#259

Post by floopidydoopidy »

sctb wrote: post #221
floopidydoopidy wrote: post #84

How much does astroturfing pay?

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12313389 and marked it off-topic. Baseless accusations of astroturfing are not allowed on HN. If you believe this is happening and you have evidence, please email us hn@ycombinator.com and we will happily investigate.

How could I possibly prove that? You guys should ban all comments that look like astroturfing. By banning accusations of astroturfing, you endorse it, because there is no way to discuss it on your forums. I'd have to organize an anti-astroturf astroturfing movement just to balance it out.

Re: PowerShell is open sourced and is available on Linux

#260

Post by itomato »

xl wrote: post #232
astrodust wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why I find PowerShell to be an answer to a question nobody asked. If bash/zsh isn't cutting it for you, drop into something like Python, Ruby or Perl to do the heavy lifting. PowerShell will never accumulate a library as comprehensive as what any of those three have, each has had decades to accumulate packages of all kinds, and more are still being added. It's odd, but not surprising given their history of "N…

[Disclaimer: I work for Microsoft.] As far as I recall, the original impetus behind what became PowerShell (as handed down to us in a conference room by Ballmer himself, sometime around 2001) was to fill the gap between ops people who did enterprise administration manually with tools like MMC and engineers who automated enterprise administration with tools like C++/DCOM. The latter were necessary in a lot of cases, b…

Not "The IT Industry", surely only a subset of Windows systems managers.
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