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Federal health expert drop flossing from health guidelines

arstechnica.com

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Re: Federal health expert drop flossing from health guidelines

#151

Post by saiya-jin »

tomaskafka wrote: post #136
robbiep wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your argument is a slippery slope for the acceptance of every kind of pseudoscience. How do we know something is 'obviously' good for you without research? NOTHING Is so cut and dry that you can make that statement. For example: organic food. Obviously, must be amazing for you. Got two great buzzwords in it: organic and food. Therefore, amazing for you. Does the research bear this out? Similarly, homeopathy, reiki, p…

Your argument is a slippery slope to discarding intuition :).

intuition can be easily swayed by emotions... harder to do with facts

Re: Federal health expert drop flossing from health guidelines

#152

Post by learc83 »

foldr wrote: post #139
MicroBerto wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Gums (and possibly even tongue) are also part of your "smile". Could have said "mouth" but smile sounds better. On the note of tongues, using a tongue scraper is a great way to get rid of nasty bacteria that causes bad breath and spreads to the rest of the teeth/gums. Cheap and effective.

I think it's maybe an American/non-American thing. Talking about healthy smiles just sounds like weird ad-speak to me.

No I found it weird as well. We don't use that term. I've never heard anyone outside of a toothbrush/toothpaste ad say it.

Re: Federal health expert drop flossing from health guidelines

#153

Post by saurik »

vonmoltke wrote: post #125

A better discussion about the lack of evidence for flossing: https://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/may-the-floss-be-with-y... Basically, yes, flossing helps, but self-flossing really doesn't do anything more than just brushing daily. I'm a little disappointed at the number of comments here along the lines of, "Well, it's obvious! Why do we need to study it?" That's a very unscientific attitude.

Or, people who were assigned a professional flosser every single school day were also more likely to brush their teeth better and were reminded constantly about their teeth and even possibly taught stuff about teeth and so maybe even ate less sugary things. I don't have access to the paper: did they at least have the professional flosser supervise the self-flossing to control for this? Otherwise this just seems like a much more likely reason for these results.

Re: Federal health expert drop flossing from health guidelines

#154

Post by spdustin »

Flossing, meh. WaterPiks, meh.

http://oralbreeze.com

Hooks right up to your faucet or shower head, has multiple tips, and is effectively an endless and super-quiet WaterPik.

I do own a WaterPik-like device, but I use saline water and a special adapter for sinus irrigation (making it a post-modern Neti Pot I guess). OralBreeze, brushing and sinus irrigation every day. Helps fight bad breath — post-nasal drip contributes a lot to bad breath, as does rotting food stuck between your teeth. For me, it's helped reduce the incidence sinus infections, too. Plus the more advanced "Neti" usage involves allowing the saline solution to flow out of your mouth, so if you're prone to tonsil stones, it can help reduce those.

Re: Federal health expert drop flossing from health guidelines

#155

Post by nailer »

83457 wrote: post #101
nailer wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

+1 but also a modern twist: intradental brushes. They're a piece of wire with a handle, coated with bits to pull plaque off teeth. You use them exactly like a toothpick but they have a nice big grip and you can get 90 degree versions with long handles for your back teeth. A pack will easily last a year. Cannot be bothered flossing (and I salivate a lot which makes it harder) but intradental brushes are now part of my…

How long does one last? Do you use one for a week, month or just whenever you change your toothbrush?

About a month. The main thing is the plastic bumps on the wire wear away after a while.

Re: Federal health expert drop flossing from health guidelines

#156

Post by vonmoltke »

saurik wrote: post #153
vonmoltke wrote: post #125

A better discussion about the lack of evidence for flossing: https://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/may-the-floss-be-with-y... Basically, yes, flossing helps, but self-flossing really doesn't do anything more than just brushing daily. I'm a little disappointed at the number of comments here along the lines of, "Well, it's obvious! Why do we need to study it?" That's a very unscientific attitude.

Or, people who were assigned a professional flosser every single school day were also more likely to brush their teeth better and were reminded constantly about their teeth and even possibly taught stuff about teeth and so maybe even ate less sugary things. I don't have access to the paper: did they at least have the professional flosser supervise the self-flossing to control for this? Otherwise this just seems like…

The reference is a systematic review, not a single study; only one study in the review was run as you indicate.

Beyond that, I am not sure what you are getting at. The point of the post I posted and the original article here is that self-flossing as an augmentation to brushing does effectively nothing. What you stated corroborates that. Am I missing something?

Re: Federal health expert drop flossing from health guidelines

#157

Post by mattkrause »

vonmoltke wrote: post #125

A better discussion about the lack of evidence for flossing: https://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/may-the-floss-be-with-y... Basically, yes, flossing helps, but self-flossing really doesn't do anything more than just brushing daily. I'm a little disappointed at the number of comments here along the lines of, "Well, it's obvious! Why do we need to study it?" That's a very unscientific attitude.

I had the opposite reaction: how on earth has no one looked into this!?

But if you dig into it, it's horrifying how little "evidence" goes into treating a lot of common medical conditions. For another trivial example, the stuff in Sudafed PE (phenylephrine) http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1081120610... is much worse than the psuedophedrine it replaced.

I wish the NIH (and other funding agencies) would consider running big, confirmatory trials on a lot of "obvious" things that affect people every day, the money clearly isn't there and it's politically difficult to get it there: There are a fair number of ignorant Congressman in the US who love to rant about 'wastes' of government money on studies like these.

Re: Federal health expert drop flossing from health guidelines

#158

Post by niccaluim »

niccaluim wrote: post #64

There are also no studies on whether parachutes prevent death when falling from the sky[1], but I'm sure as shit still wearing one when I jump out of a plane! [1] http://www.bmj.com/content/327/7429/1459.long

Everyone replying to this so far is fun at parties, I'm sure of it.

Re: Federal health expert drop flossing from health guidelines

#159

Post by badsock »

ewzimm wrote: post #135
badsock wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Flossing can drive bacteria deeper into your gums, even causing them to be enter the bloodstream, which then (there's been some evidence) can have an influence on heart disease. Public policy needs research. Human history is absolutely stacked with "obvious" truths turning out to be harmful falsehoods.

I just looked that up, and I did find some advice that flossing addresses the food issue but not the issue of a bacterial infection not attached to pieces of food, which is probably also obvious. There are suggestions to use a water pick instead of flossing, which dentists have also recommended for a long time, but it's just not as available as string or toothpicks. It's not productive to tell everyone only to use th…

My point isn't that there's always new things to discover, it's that nature has so routinely made fools of us that the argument of "it's obvious" should carry little weight.

Re: Federal health expert drop flossing from health guidelines

#160

Post by specialist »

flukus wrote: post #3
adrianN wrote: post #2

I wonder why they don't fund proper studies. Maybe because the effect is too obvious to question? My oral hygienist can tell whether I floss regularly or not, so there must be an observable difference in plaque buildup. Subjectively my gums also feel better and bleed less when I floss regularly.

I've never flossed, I don't have gaps in my teeth to get the floss in. My first trip to the dentist in 25 years was a few weeks ago and my teeth were perfect except for a wisdom tooth and the damage it caused. So i'm kind of skeptical of the effect. Edit - I always wonder what kind of toothbrush other people use. I've always used electric ones so I wonder if that helps.

Congratulations. You won the genetic lottery.

I did well, for a while, too. Then I had a lot of chemo. First year post, I had 14 cavities requiring fillings. Now I have 3 crowns.

Floss your teeth, preferably with a water pick. Older you will thank younger you.

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