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Autopsy reveals Debian founder committed suicide

theregister.co.uk

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Re: Autopsy reveals Debian founder committed suicide

#71

Post by jcranmer »

madaxe_again wrote: post #18
mordocai wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know enough about it to comment on it myself, but I saw comments elsewhere that apparently bruises appearing post mortem are quite common and those people appeared to think that was the likely cause of the bruises indicated in the autopsy. Found where I read those comments and it has also been updated: https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/4rlar5/official_repo...

You don't get abrasions post-mortem, however, and if it were post-mortem bruising, you'd expect it in parts of his body that were lower than others. Having bruises and abrasions on his front, back, sides and face is not a natural thing that happens after death. It's a thing that happens when you're roughed up - if you read the autopsy report there are a variety of injuries that you'd have to try pretty hard to inflic…

The lacerations are solely on the front, upper portion of his head. The police report said that he had been banging his head while in the police car, which can certainly explain those lacerations.

The abrasions are predominantly on the left side of the body. If you imagine that he started the suicide sitting on top of the (left, from the view of the door) railing, facing forward, and then he fell off the railing towards his left as he fell, you can explain most of the abrasions by the railing or the balusters scraping him hard as he fell, ending up (as he was found) in a prone position, head facing upstairs. The upper right back and right front shin abrasions are the hardest to fit in geometry, though.

Without more detailed models of the house geometry and the bruises/cuts/scrapes on the body, it's hard to make a better judgement, but the evidence as it stands doesn't refute the official police report.

Re: Autopsy reveals Debian founder committed suicide

#72

Post by digler999 »

Zigurd wrote: post #46
jacquesm wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Going 'tit for tat' on people that carry weapons and are totally within their rights of using them on you when you go 'tit for tat' seems like a career limiting move to me.

There is a lot of space between doing nothing, or filing a complaint that gets thrown in a wastebasket, and having a lynching. Why, for example, don't we have in-depth media coverage of the cops who did these killings? What are their backgrounds? Do they have a history of extralegal violence? What are their community connections, and do those have anything to do with them not having been arrested for, at least, mansl…

I think you're lost, here http://www.infowars.com is where you probably meant to go. You're welcome.

Re: Autopsy reveals Debian founder committed suicide

#73

Post by geggam »

dpark wrote: post #67
geggam wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

enjoy that illusion... one day you will meet the police and think back .. hopefully you remember and feel at least a bit ashamed

Attitudes like yours are unhelpful. If all police are fundamentally evil, then there can be no conversation about how to fix the problems with police abuses. If all police are not fundamentally evil, then people like you poison the well and make it more difficult to discuss and maybe fix some of the problems. If all police are fundamentally evil, then people like you are wasting everyone's time anyway. Either way, yo…

because posting on HN is a social fix ?

and im moronic ?

Re: Autopsy reveals Debian founder committed suicide

#74

Post by dpark »

geggam wrote: post #73
dpark wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Attitudes like yours are unhelpful. If all police are fundamentally evil, then there can be no conversation about how to fix the problems with police abuses. If all police are not fundamentally evil, then people like you poison the well and make it more difficult to discuss and maybe fix some of the problems. If all police are fundamentally evil, then people like you are wasting everyone's time anyway. Either way, yo…

because posting on HN is a social fix ? and im moronic ?

Attitudes like yours are poisonous in general, not just on HN.

And yes, your paranoid belief that all police are evildoers just waiting around every corner to assault strangers is moronic. Your paranoia is stopping you from engaging in rational thought about the police.

Re: Autopsy reveals Debian founder committed suicide

#75

Post by downandout »

A neighbor told the city's investigators that Murdock had just split up with his girlfriend and was facing eviction

How is someone so well known in the software industry so hard up for money that they are facing eviction? Far lesser engineers than he have never had problems earning enough money to get by. The whole thing is very sad, and clearly money wasn't his only problem, but it's one issue that someone with his resume shouldn't have been facing.

Re: Autopsy reveals Debian founder committed suicide

#76

Post by DanBC »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #69
DanBC wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And secondly, Ian was violently attempting to break into a neighbor's apartment by bashing down the front door. What exactly do you think should happen in such an instance? I'll tell you what I'd do -- I'd want the police to come as quickly as possible and deal with it, using whatever force is necessary to stop the in-progress home invasion, because if an intruder breaks through my door I have no choice but to shoo…

Maybe different from a violent angry large man battering down your door just to get at you? Offers of tea are reputedly less effective in that case.

I didn't know it was different when I offered him a cup of tea. He'd already kicked in the roof hatch and was inside the house.

I'd have done the same if he'd been kicking the door.

> Offers of tea are reputedly less effective in that case.

No, they're not less effective, and this might by why the US police kill hundreds of people each year, especially people with mental illness.

You might want to read some of the de-escalation stuff coming from the English NHS at the moment. Lots of it comes from forensic settings (where people are there with a criminal justice involvement) or settings for people with behaviour seen as challenging -- exactly the kind of behaviour Ian Murdoch is described as exhibiting.

Obviously "kill the patient" isn't an option. But people still talk about the need to reduce frequency of seclusion and length of each episode of seclusion; or about reducing the frequency of rapid tranquilisation and reducing unplanned injection into buttocks vs managed oral administration.

Positive and Proactive Care: Reducing the need for restrictive interventions:https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/positive-and-proa...

Physical Restraint in Crisis care: https://www.mind.org.uk/media/197120/physical_restraint_fina...

Violence and aggression, short term management in mental health, health, and community settings: https://www.nice.org.uk/guidance/ng10

None of this guidance says "escalate it".

Re: Autopsy reveals Debian founder committed suicide

#77

Post by Tomte »

downandout wrote: post #75

A neighbor told the city's investigators that Murdock had just split up with his girlfriend and was facing eviction How is someone so well known in the software industry so hard up for money that they are facing eviction? Far lesser engineers than he have never had problems earning enough money to get by. The whole thing is very sad, and clearly money wasn't his only problem, but it's one issue that someone with his…

There are other reasons to get evicted besides not paying rent. We don't know why the landlord wanted him out.

Re: Autopsy reveals Debian founder committed suicide

#78

Post by dang »

dpark wrote: post #57
geggam wrote: post #52

you are under the impression the police discriminate... they do ... if you are blue you get away with everything... everyone else they hate ( the sheep )

This is moronic. Even if you believe that all police are bad actors, it doesn't make any sense that they would be randomly attacking Murdock as he described. Is it impossible? No. Is it far, far less likely than Murdock having a psychotic break and lapsing into paranoia and confusion? Yes.

> This is moronic.

Please don't break the HN guidelines with name-calling like this, no matter how wrong another comment may be.

Your comment would be much stronger and more convincing without that first bit.

Re: Autopsy reveals Debian founder committed suicide

#79

Post by dang »

geggam wrote: post #52

you are under the impression the police discriminate... they do ... if you are blue you get away with everything... everyone else they hate ( the sheep )

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12051299 and marked it off-topic.

Re: Autopsy reveals Debian founder committed suicide

#80

Post by pjlegato »

madaxe_again wrote: post #18
mordocai wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know enough about it to comment on it myself, but I saw comments elsewhere that apparently bruises appearing post mortem are quite common and those people appeared to think that was the likely cause of the bruises indicated in the autopsy. Found where I read those comments and it has also been updated: https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/4rlar5/official_repo...

You don't get abrasions post-mortem, however, and if it were post-mortem bruising, you'd expect it in parts of his body that were lower than others. Having bruises and abrasions on his front, back, sides and face is not a natural thing that happens after death. It's a thing that happens when you're roughed up - if you read the autopsy report there are a variety of injuries that you'd have to try pretty hard to inflic…

> they're armed to the teeth and usually in full armour, and usually sat in an armoured and armed vehicle

This is absurd hyperbole.

Have you ever been to the US? Your use of British spellings suggests you are not from here.

I have lived in the US for decades. I have personally seen hundreds, perhaps thousands, of police officers in socioeconomic contexts ranging from high crime inner city ghettoes to wealthy suburbs. 99%+ were walking around in an ordinary uniform, not sitting in a vehicle (much less an "armoured and armed" tank), were not wearing any kind of armor (much less "full armour"), and were not "armed to the teeth" in any sense, unless you consider carrying a handgun to be "armed to the teeth."

Are you deliberately trying to mislead foreigners who haven't ever been here into thinking that the US is some sort of militarized police state, or merely repeating secondhand reports from far-leftist news sources that are politically motivated into making foreigners think that about the US?

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