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NASA Data Shows Toxic Air Threat Choking Indian Subcontinent

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Re: NASA Data Shows Toxic Air Threat Choking Indian Subcontinent

#91

Post by djsumdog »

stickfigure wrote: post #80
kamaal wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would anyone protest? India doesn't have enough electricity to waste on Malls and Movies theaters. Or big offices like tech parks in Bangalore! What you have mentioned applies to every tech park in Bangalore, so should people now protest against their very source of employment?

India doesn't have enough electricity There's something fundamentally broken about this statement, which suggests a deeper problem - why isn't the market for electricity working in India?

The grid in India is pretty broken. My dad had dreams of going back to India to retire, but on his last trip he told me housing was now super expensive, the pollution was still terrible, the air not fit to breath and the water still unsafe to drink.

In other countries we take a national grid for granted. In Europe, power can be bought and sold from country to country. India may be lacking in capacity, but even if they're not, the grid is fragile, unreliable and not a national one.

There are over a billion people living there too, in a land mass way smaller than their more populous neighbour to the north (and let's not forget all of China's trouble with pollution as well).

Re: NASA Data Shows Toxic Air Threat Choking Indian Subcontinent

#92

Post by X86BSD »

j0e1 wrote: post #84

As someone who grew up in New Delhi, I think the government has taken quite a few steps like passing laws that require all public transport to run only on CNG, mandating industries to be positioned outside the city and more recently having policies to curb number of cars on the road. But the problem of pollution never seemed to improve. Optimistically I've told myself that if those measures weren't taken we would hav…

Having been to Delhi that does not seem to be enforced or effective. There are still petrol stations all over. And the pollution is still appalling.

Re: NASA Data Shows Toxic Air Threat Choking Indian Subcontinent

#93

Post by Retric »

djsumdog wrote: post #91
stickfigure wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

India doesn't have enough electricity There's something fundamentally broken about this statement, which suggests a deeper problem - why isn't the market for electricity working in India?

The grid in India is pretty broken. My dad had dreams of going back to India to retire, but on his last trip he told me housing was now super expensive, the pollution was still terrible, the air not fit to breath and the water still unsafe to drink. In other countries we take a national grid for granted. In Europe, power can be bought and sold from country to country. India may be lacking in capacity, but even if the…

A huge chunk of china is basically uninhabitable.

http://www.china-mike.com/china-travel-tips/tourist-maps/chi...

PS: You can draw a strait line in China with 6% of the population on the larger half, and 94% of the population on the smaller half.

http://www.undertheraedar.com/2012/06/population-of-china.ht...

Re: NASA Data Shows Toxic Air Threat Choking Indian Subcontinent

#94

Post by marvindanig »

j0e1 wrote: post #84

As someone who grew up in New Delhi, I think the government has taken quite a few steps like passing laws that require all public transport to run only on CNG, mandating industries to be positioned outside the city and more recently having policies to curb number of cars on the road. But the problem of pollution never seemed to improve. Optimistically I've told myself that if those measures weren't taken we would hav…

Why doesn't the Indian government speak to Tesla Motors/Solar City? They can help you zero down on traffic/power generation related pollution completely.

Indian engineers are smart people and given that much of EV technology is now proven and even open source!, I think it will make sense for the people there to adopt alternative tech. Have you tried talking to Tesla to open up R&D center with Tatas/Mahindras/whoever?

I do sense that corruption and its acceptance among citizenry is still going to be a major impediment but then it might just work. The only challenge would probably be to manufacture at scale and keep the car costs low to fit the average budget there.

But then India does get more than its fair share of tropical sun! :-)

Re: NASA Data Shows Toxic Air Threat Choking Indian Subcontinent

#95

Post by rapind »

Retric wrote: post #93
djsumdog wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The grid in India is pretty broken. My dad had dreams of going back to India to retire, but on his last trip he told me housing was now super expensive, the pollution was still terrible, the air not fit to breath and the water still unsafe to drink. In other countries we take a national grid for granted. In Europe, power can be bought and sold from country to country. India may be lacking in capacity, but even if the…

A huge chunk of china is basically uninhabitable. http://www.china-mike.com/china-travel-tips/tourist-maps/chi... PS: You can draw a strait line in China with 6% of the population on the larger half, and 94% of the population on the smaller half. http://www.undertheraedar.com/2012/06/population-of-china.ht...

You could probably do the same in Canada fwiw.

Re: NASA Data Shows Toxic Air Threat Choking Indian Subcontinent

#96

Post by ismyrnow »

I'm surprised the article doesn't mention density of cattle farming. I know it's a complicated issue, but my understanding is that industrial animal production affects climate more than transportation does.

http://www.fao.org/Ag/againfo/resources/en/glw/Density_maps/...

https://www3.epa.gov/climatechange/ghgemissions/global.html

Re: NASA Data Shows Toxic Air Threat Choking Indian Subcontinent

#97

Post by hx87 »

mc32 wrote: post #36
kartD wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't think so, India is typically 4 stroke because of pollution norms and 4 strokes are more fuel efficient which we're very sensitive to. Frankly, India's problem can only be fixed by population control. If Sanjay Gandhi hadn't been an idiot and forever poisoned the idea of population control, India would be much better off, especially if we can get the population to around 300M - 500M

I agree pop growth is an issue... But asking the pop to drop by two thirds is out of bounds. You cannot get that drop without natural decline over many generations or some kind of dreadful calamity. Natural decrease will happen but over generations, with the expected economic consequences of fewer people contributing to an economy. Maybe Japan can show the way, but so far, they are still basing their economy on growt…

I find strange this whole idea that economic growth requires population growth. Why can't each person, aided by automation, simply produce and consume more?

Re: NASA Data Shows Toxic Air Threat Choking Indian Subcontinent

#98

Post by hx87 »

mikeash wrote: post #63
jfoster wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like both of them might be worth fixing and at least part of the solution is the same.

Definitely, and I certainly wouldn't argue against taking action against CO2 emissions because local air pollution is a bigger problem. Fight both, and where possible find solutions that help both. The tradeoffs tend to be in smaller fixes anyway. With diesel engines, there's a point where you may have to choose between more CO2 and fewer particulates, or more particulates and less CO2. But obviously both will be imp…

The trade-off in diesel engines is between more CO2 and more nitrogen oxides. Burning lean mixtures with lots of excess oxygen tends to reduce both particulates (since they are more completely burned) and CO2 (since combustion is more efficient) at a cost of nitrogen-oxygen side reactions.

Re: NASA Data Shows Toxic Air Threat Choking Indian Subcontinent

#99

Post by Retric »

rapind wrote: post #95
Retric wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A huge chunk of china is basically uninhabitable. http://www.china-mike.com/china-travel-tips/tourist-maps/chi... PS: You can draw a strait line in China with 6% of the population on the larger half, and 94% of the population on the smaller half. http://www.undertheraedar.com/2012/06/population-of-china.ht...

You could probably do the same in Canada fwiw.

True enough. Though Canada has more land than China and less than 3% of China's population. So, it's not nearly as big a deal.

Re: NASA Data Shows Toxic Air Threat Choking Indian Subcontinent

#100

Post by _navaneethan »

I am from India. Especially from Bangalore. I commute daily 30kms up and down. I am facing breathing polluted air issues. In fact I was looking for good pollution filter masks. But I am unable to get the good one. Since the reviews of them are unsatisfactory

I am trying to come out of this issue at all. At the same time I don't want to leave my lovable tech job.

Anybody experienced the same issues? Any advise ?

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