Google collects metadata from Android phones • Hacker News Board

Re: Google collects metadata from Android phones

#241

Post by dredmorbius » Sat, Jul 02, 2016, 5:19 PM UTC

nickpsecurity wrote: post #182

lostlogin wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dont defend the creepy advertisers but banning their crap would bankrupt and destroy them.

And imagine the online world loosing both Google and Mozilla. Or development of Firefox, Chrome, and Android slowing to a crawl as they went paid or donation-only. Big companies would win in browser and mobile market by default.

Red Herring.

Fixing the funding model is an independent problem.

I'm not saying that advertising and software development aren't prresently linked through funding. But the process is _fundamentally_ unbundled, through the vehicle of Free Software development and licensing.

The costs for advertising are approximately $500 per year per capita in the developed world (~1 billion persons), plus all the associated privacy, surveillance, security, and chilling-effects risks.

A shift of that basis from advertising to a syndicated content-and-development support tax would cut the cord between both advertising and content, and advertising and software development. Treating both writing of content (fiction, nonfiction, journalism, research) and software development as public goods could achieve some very strong social benefits (or at least present a different set of problems for us to jaw over on HN, though the concept of a technology startup incubator might also see some ground shifts).

Bust out of that box a bit, Nick.

Detachable headphones and mics.

Re: Google collects metadata from Android phones

#242

Post by dredmorbius » Sat, Jul 02, 2016, 5:20 PM UTC

supernovae wrote: post #27

jswny wrote: post #15

Are people really surprised about this anymore? I can't say that I am. Google is a company which makes a lot of money off of their platforms. I expect them to be collecting data wherever and whenever they can. I see stories like this every day but I've become accustomed to it because it's such a normal practice nowadays, especially from a company like google which provides so many advertising services. I'm not saying…

Maybe not surprised, but they begrudge everyone else for this more than they do google, and that's what I think sucks. It seems OK for Apple/Google to do whatever they need to do to have a competitive app store with all its analytics and understanding its customer to sell it advertising but if other companies do it, its all the sudden the sky is falling

Slack shown Google is lessenning markedly.

With very good cause.

Re: Google collects metadata from Android phones

#243

Post by RodericDay » Sat, Jul 02, 2016, 5:34 PM UTC

ffwd wrote: post #236

whamlastxmas wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I make the same assumption and the chilling effect is frustrating. I assume everything I type on the internet is able to be tied back to me if anyone at the NSA etc wanted to look at me specifically. Unless you always use a VPN (or Tor) for all of your accounts and go through the unreasonable efforts of preventing browser fingerprinting, chances are this is true for everyone. And even those efforts are thwarted if th…

I'm not disagreeing with you but I'm curious what specific things you feel are 'chilled'? People in western countries can still write whatever they want - anti-government, anti-capitalism, whatever else. In fact there seem to be more conspiracy theories, Obama hate, and Clinton and David Cameron hate than at any time in human history. Like the most worry I have is having private actors look into my history and ban me…

You wouldn't know about it if someone who was doing anti-government or anti-capitalism stuff got successfully blackmailed before achieving their objective.

This would maintain the illusion of things happening without actually allowing them to come to fruition.

Re: Google collects metadata from Android phones

#244

Post by evilduck » Sat, Jul 02, 2016, 6:09 PM UTC

throwanem wrote: post #103

dublinben wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The alternative is a physically distinct work and personal device. This has been the solution for many years. Only recently have people wanted to "BYOD" and use their personal device for work purposes.

On that point, I very recently discovered [1] that connecting an iOS device to an Exchange account via ActiveSync enables the organization's Exchange administrators to remotely wipe the entire contents of the device - not just the content actually provided via the account, but everything . I am astonished and disappointed that Apple saw fit not to warn the user this could happen. Even Google gets this right; when you…

Current versions of iOS do make it clear.

http://9to5mac.com/2016/03/02/ios-9-3-makes-it-abundantly-cl...

Re: Google collects metadata from Android phones

#245

Post by Drdrdrq » Sat, Jul 02, 2016, 6:34 PM UTC

guelo wrote: post #139

jsprogrammer wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to that diff, Google moved from opt-in sharing of DoubleClick cookies, to...potentially default-in, with a possible opt-out option buried in some unidentified settings page?

To disable it on Android go to: Settings -> Google -> Ads -> Opt out of interest-based ads But the surprise twist is that Apple does the same thing! To disable it on iPhones go to: Settings -> Privacy -> Advertising -> Limit Ad

And: Settings -> Security -> Apps with usage access (turn off for each app). And probably countless other settings too. Good luck finding, understanding and setting them, let alone keeping up with them from one upgrade to another! My guess is they are there for legal and PR reasons: "well, if you don't like it, you can just turn it off in Settings -> Somewhere -> Makes no Sense... See? It's not us, it's just you..." Seriously, I am not even in their jurisdiction. How dare they spy on me?!?

Re: Google collects metadata from Android phones

#246

Post by Drdrdrq » Sat, Jul 02, 2016, 6:39 PM UTC

chrsstrm wrote: post #193

guelo wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To disable it on Android go to: Settings -> Google -> Ads -> Opt out of interest-based ads But the surprise twist is that Apple does the same thing! To disable it on iPhones go to: Settings -> Privacy -> Advertising -> Limit Ad

Even the opt-out seems backwards. I checked the setting, immediately saw that the button was disabled and thought, "Oh, I'm good." Until I read the description and thought about it. The switch needs to be "on" to opt-out. http://imgur.com/ZZTL3ct Important to note is that it also says "...if you clear your cache, you will lose your opt-out setting." What cache?

Yeah, dark pattern of UX all over again. Seriously, how about "never send any data to Google unless I explicitly requested it"? I guess that is not in their short-term interest though. Yeah, don't do evil unless you can... :(

Re: Google collects metadata from Android phones

#247

Post by tunap » Sat, Jul 02, 2016, 7:34 PM UTC

lostlogin wrote: post #167

tunap wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cannot find specifics now(my N900 doesn't render many pages anymore), but it was widely known prior to 2010 that snApple slurps data every 45 min, or 16 x's a day. When I read that I thought it was an interesting coincidence that the ISS circles the Earth at the same rate. Possible discussion from 2011, cannot open the page: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/3200399?start=0&tstart=...

Don't think that's the right link, but it is complaints about data usage.

Specifics are hard to come by, perhaps it was a presentation or IRC revelations. Either way, search is no longer optimized for finding info for non-consumption results and Apple is accomplished at forcing NDAs and hiding specifics behind vague legalese... until circumstances arise that can no longer be vehemently denied and the flowery marketing speak flows: they seem to address the specific concerns without actually being definitive. Oh yeah, they often promise not to do questionable tasks, like accidentally tracking all iphones for over a year, too.

Links from the past:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/technology/2010/06/apple-loc...

http://lifehacker.com/5864518/is-my-phone-spying-on-me-and-w...

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-apple-lawsuit-idUSTRE6BR1Y...

https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2010/03/iphone-developer-progr...

Re: Google collects metadata from Android phones

#248

Post by tunap » Sat, Jul 02, 2016, 7:59 PM UTC

tunap wrote: post #247

lostlogin wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't think that's the right link, but it is complaints about data usage.

Specifics are hard to come by, perhaps it was a presentation or IRC revelations. Either way, search is no longer optimized for finding info for non-consumption results and Apple is accomplished at forcing NDAs and hiding specifics behind vague legalese... until circumstances arise that can no longer be vehemently denied and the flowery marketing speak flows: they seem to address the specific concerns without actually…

PS: I know, I know, *everybody's doing it". That doesn't necessarily equate to being just, only that it is within our technological means. Some more relics from the past...

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/how-the-nsa-spies-...

https://www.aclu.org/cell-phone-location-tracking-request-re...

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2986988/privacy/the-price-of-...

Re: Google collects metadata from Android phones

#249

Post by gvurrdon » Sat, Jul 02, 2016, 9:24 PM UTC

616c wrote: post #184

gvurrdon wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The functions of which xprivacy is capable seem excellent. Unfortunately, when I tried it I found it to be an enormous hassle to use. The UI was bad enough but upgrading Cyanogenmod with xposed and xprivacy was more of a nuisance. Cyanogenmod's Privacy Guard is easy enough to use though its protections don't go as far as I'd like. Pdroid seemed to be a reasonable compromise in ease of use and protection between the t…

Privacy Guard will not allow API calls and stuff them with fake data, which I imagine is not possible with Cyanogen or any conventional outfit for legal and regulatory reasons. I do not think the UI is great, but articles like this are not either. I made my choice.

Indeed, Privacy Guard can't do that, unfortunately.

Re: Google collects metadata from Android phones

#250

Post by rpgmaker » Sat, Jul 02, 2016, 10:10 PM UTC

It's a minor quibble but is it accurate to put the project under the US "government" umbrella (@usgov)? I don't think the USG existed in any meaningful sense before confederation.