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Spain Runs Out of Workers with Almost 5M Unemployed

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Re: Spain Runs Out of Workers with Almost 5M Unemployed

#321

Post by pyvpx »

13of40 wrote: post #184
charlesdm wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you considered working remotely for a US company? I know a guy making €7 or 8,000 per month, after tax, living in Paris. Best of both worlds: amazing quality of living, cheap cost of living + healthcare, lots of spending (or investing) money! Seems to be working well for him.

Same here. I know at least 4 people who are making six figure (US) salaries working for a US company from Europe. All for the same company and it's kind of hard to get in, but still...

how did they come across these remote-friendly positions?

Re: Spain Runs Out of Workers with Almost 5M Unemployed

#322

Post by mapt »

themartorana wrote: post #103
cloakandswagger wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This assumption is the same mistake made by almost all supranational federalists. Europe is composed of different countries with vastly different languages, cultures and economic conditions. Just because they're technically "joined" together via treaties doesn't mean labor is going to naturally distribute throughout the union.

And yet they thought a shared currency would be no big deal.

No, this could totally have worked. Once the Euro was implemented, they had a choice: Either do what's necessary for real large-scale labor-market mobility (where migration becomes a typical part of life and a substantial part of every paycheck gets remitted back to one's family), and-or create a fiscal union where Spanish spending gets subsidized by German taxes for the sake of unity.

They opened the door a bit to the former legally but didn't force the issue sufficiently to make the numbers work, nor did they let economies collapse in ways that cause large-scale migration (preferring to buoy them up with unsustainable debt). They did little towards the latter.

This was inadequate, and caused a massive, entirely foreseeable debt crisis because the ability to print money for the use of a single national economy that desperately needs inflation, was lost. The thing that the Eurodollar politicians were trying to force the 2000's politicians to do, did not come to pass.

Re: Spain Runs Out of Workers with Almost 5M Unemployed

#323

Post by mapt »

DanBC wrote: post #202
NetStrikeForce wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What? No. There are countless unemployed nurses in Spain, Portugal and Ireland. Ask the NHS how many they bring in every year.

...and yet there are still nursing shortages, with many unfilled posts. These are jobs that have been advertised but unfilled.

Suggestion: You're not allowed to use the term 'unfilled' in this conversation.

Use the term 'unfilled at the listed salary'.

Re: Spain Runs Out of Workers with Almost 5M Unemployed

#324

Post by paol »

marcocampos wrote: post #312
paol wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me correct your numbers. For 1500€ monthly net your employer will pay about 3000€ (~20% income tax + ~30% social security). Multiply by 14 (Yes there are 14 salaries in a year. Don't ask.) and the yearly gross is 42000€. Edit: https://casa.sapo.pt/ for a look at the real estate market. "para venda" is for sale, "para alugar/aluguer" is for rent.

In Portugal, Social Security taxation for a full-time employee is 11%. 42000€ per year gross salary lands you in the 28.5% income tax. A yearly gross salary of 42000€ is about +/- 1800€ salary/month.

You're apparently unaware that not all tax appears on your salary receipt. Employers have to pay 20% to SS, on top of the 11% that the employee pays. (This amount doesn't count toward your gross income for IRS purposes though, which is relevant to your point)

The distinction is largely a technicality, all the more because both parts of the SS contribution are paid by the employer directly to the state, but it does have one effect: because the 20% don't show up in the salary receipt, most portuguese people are, like you, blissfully unaware of what the real tax rate on their salaries is.

Re: Spain Runs Out of Workers with Almost 5M Unemployed

#325

Post by kspaans »

Waterluvian wrote: post #157
vemv wrote: post #29

Spanish dev here, 3 years in the business, been twice a freelancer and twice an employee. My main complaints: - The maximum salary a developer can earn at any given company is almost written in stone - around 36000 euros. Every public job posting will have that figure as the max. When it's higher, they'll water it down in the interview. Why? Probably because they don't have the notion of a 10x programmer at all. We a…

Developers are not fungible. But in my opinion: this "10x" term really has to go away. We need a better way to describe the reality that there's a range in quality and capability for developers that doesn't suggest an order of magnitude. That just means corner cutting.

It is a bit silly, but try thinking of it as "one developer who helps makes ten others be twice as productive". It could even be a non-technical manager who is really good at taking care of all of the non-development work for the team, allowing them to focus on what they do best.

Re: Spain Runs Out of Workers with Almost 5M Unemployed

#326

Post by aianus »

emilburzo wrote: post #154
smsm42 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know a lot of US companies hiring remotely. Two reasons: 1) costs (you're not competing with Google and Facebook on salary, at least not directly) and somewhat related 2) bigger applicant pool. This is especially true if you're looking for specific skills - much easier to find somebody if you're looking at 10x market. For many developer positions, having a person in the office is not much better than having remote…

Where does one find these companies? Almost all remote job posts that I find end with "(US only)" Example: https://hnjobs.emilburzo.com/#remote%20%22us%20only%22

My employer is hiring multiple remote positions: https://www.coinbase.com/careers

Re: Spain Runs Out of Workers with Almost 5M Unemployed

#327

Post by aianus »

_mikz wrote: post #308
jordinl wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

54k is still less than what I make working remotely for American companies...

But you actually get cool place to work, meet people and maybe even make friends. Might not be for everyone, but sometimes money is not everything. Personal interaction can be strong motivator. We are in the same building as MobileJazz and both of our offices have a big terrace and BBQ which we put to fair use!

> But you actually get cool place to work, meet people and maybe even make friends.

You can do this at co-working spaces with other people who work remotely for US companies.

Re: Spain Runs Out of Workers with Almost 5M Unemployed

#328

Post by albertop »

vemv wrote: post #29

Spanish dev here, 3 years in the business, been twice a freelancer and twice an employee. My main complaints: - The maximum salary a developer can earn at any given company is almost written in stone - around 36000 euros. Every public job posting will have that figure as the max. When it's higher, they'll water it down in the interview. Why? Probably because they don't have the notion of a 10x programmer at all. We a…

Why do you think market for software developers is so poor in Spain?

Re: Spain Runs Out of Workers with Almost 5M Unemployed

#329

Post by flexie »

NetStrikeForce wrote: post #278
flexie wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

36,000 euro in, say, Valencia, that's close to 100,000 dollars in San Francisco when adjusting for purchasing power. Not great but certainly not that bad either. For someone with three years experience. I know a team of developers south of Valencia who make way more than that. They work out of a mansion with an infinity pool. Doing simple websites. Whereas 36,000 euro in Southern Spain (where the unemployment is high…

> I know a team of developers south of Valencia who make way more than that. They work out of a mansion with an infinity pool. Doing simple websites. Sounds like a great setup to raise a family... not. Just saying, what sounds amazing for young and single white guys might not be great for the rest of the population. Wouldn't it be better if each of them could have their own flat and privacy for the same price?

Oh, I was talking about their office. They live elsewhere. Several in their 40s.

Re: Spain Runs Out of Workers with Almost 5M Unemployed

#330

Post by pvaldes »

knocte wrote: post #317
pvaldes wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Spanish executives are less-skilled than their competitors in Germany, France or Italy This is hilarious. Say that to Amancio Ortega :-)

Your comment is hilarious, in itself. Actually, you're hilarious.

Glad to be able to put some happiness in your world. Now seriously; do you think that one single unnamed study can be token as proof of what they are claiming? This is not much different to that 'The scientists say that...' mantra. How many executives were evaluated? 3?, 5?, 50?. We don't know.
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