Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’ • Hacker News Board

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#41

Post by emodendroket » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:07 PM UTC

bmmayer1 wrote: post #8

This is a serious security threat for many Muslims abroad, given that premarital sex is severely punishable in several Islamic countries (including Pakistan mentioned in the leak), and even within countries where it isn't punishable by law, those who get caught frequently risk honor attacks from their families as has happened in the US, UK, India and elsewhere. Obviously dating != sex but there's probably enough 'smo…

People trading marriage proposals doesn't seem that salacious, unless Vice is just picking uninteresting samples.

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#42

Post by mc32 » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:11 PM UTC

emodendroket wrote: post #41

bmmayer1 wrote: post #8

This is a serious security threat for many Muslims abroad, given that premarital sex is severely punishable in several Islamic countries (including Pakistan mentioned in the leak), and even within countries where it isn't punishable by law, those who get caught frequently risk honor attacks from their families as has happened in the US, UK, India and elsewhere. Obviously dating != sex but there's probably enough 'smo…

People trading marriage proposals doesn't seem that salacious, unless Vice is just picking uninteresting samples.

I would hope Vice is being prudent in their examples. It'd potentially be hazardous to expose people's privacy even more.

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#43

Post by whamlastxmas » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:13 PM UTC

ss108 wrote: post #39

The comments about honor killings and stoning for adultery are a bit ridiculous. Honor killings usually happen in tribal and rural segments of Pakistan--not the kinds of people who use Muslim Match. Not all of the users are even from Pakistan, many were probably from the US and the UK, and a lot of the people on there were just genuinely looking for a spouse. Do you guys really think that nobody has premarital sex in…

>usually

That word is the sad qualifier to this statement. There are plenty of instances of this happening in popular areas, even outside a well protected courthouse in Pakistan's second largest city by the person's own family: http://www.cbsnews.com/news/pregnant-pakistani-womans-public...

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#44

Post by mc32 » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:14 PM UTC

ss108 wrote: post #39

The comments about honor killings and stoning for adultery are a bit ridiculous. Honor killings usually happen in tribal and rural segments of Pakistan--not the kinds of people who use Muslim Match. Not all of the users are even from Pakistan, many were probably from the US and the UK, and a lot of the people on there were just genuinely looking for a spouse. Do you guys really think that nobody has premarital sex in…

Of course premarital sex happens, but I think it's one of those things that people know happen and allow to happen so long as it's not flaunted.

The jump may be an expression of concern for the people who could be negatively affected by the disclosure of their activities.

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#45

Post by basseq » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:14 PM UTC

At the risk of making a tenuous (and inflammatory) connection, I'm struck by the difference in tone between this and the Ashley Madison leak.

Here, there's sentiments of "how terrible", "leaked users might have severe consequences", and "this ruins the privacy where people get away from repressive social mores".

Ashley Madison, by comparison, was met with sentiments of "good!", "glad we're outing adulters", and "these people are getting what's coming to them".

Yes, I know AM was explicitly based on having an affair, where this dataset might just include people who are committing adultery (with varying cultural definitions of "adultery"). But other than impressing our own values on the situation (e.g., "cheating on your wife" = bad; "premarital relations" = ok), how do you explain the difference?

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#46

Post by basseq » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:15 PM UTC

basseq wrote: post #45

At the risk of making a tenuous (and inflammatory) connection, I'm struck by the difference in tone between this and the Ashley Madison leak. Here, there's sentiments of "how terrible", "leaked users might have severe consequences", and "this ruins the privacy where people get away from repressive social mores". Ashley Madison, by comparison, was met with sentiments of "good!", "glad we're outing adulters", and "thes…

Example: HN gleefully ate up analytics on the AM dataset. What men were saying, searching for, the ratio of men to women, etc. Will we do the same here?

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#47

Post by jdmichal » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:17 PM UTC

ss108 wrote: post #39

The comments about honor killings and stoning for adultery are a bit ridiculous. Honor killings usually happen in tribal and rural segments of Pakistan--not the kinds of people who use Muslim Match. Not all of the users are even from Pakistan, many were probably from the US and the UK, and a lot of the people on there were just genuinely looking for a spouse. Do you guys really think that nobody has premarital sex in…

> Honor killings usually happen in tribal and rural segments of Pakistan--not the kinds of people who use Muslim Match.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honor_killing#By_region

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#48

Post by basseq » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:18 PM UTC

x5n1 wrote: post #29

> This is a serious security threat for many Muslims abroad. It's not a threat. It's a wake up call. The less you can bury all that goes on under the rug the less easier it is to justify repressive, hypocritical cultures like the cultures around Islam.

You're getting downvoted, but there's a grain of truth here. If our perspective is, "It's ok that people were on this site, but bad that it leaked because consequences," shouldn't we be willing to focus on how to remove those consequences and the system that puts them in place?

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#49

Post by openasocket » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:18 PM UTC

vox_mollis wrote: post #38

Someone1234 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And by "it" you mean the Islamic religion I assume? I don't see what distinction you're trying to make. Is it somehow more acceptable to be prejudice against an entire religion than it is to be prejudice against an entire race? Is that really the discussion you want to have, that some prejudice is acceptable and other prejudice is not?

Well, yes. The nominal standard here is whether the prejudice is against something the individual has choice over. One does not choose one's race, whereas once does choose one's own religion, even if raised in an environment suffused with it. Choice and agency is the standard by which most people draw the line between generic prejudice and hate. It's no coincidence that gay rights dramatically improved along with wid…

It's still the result of stereotypes and over-generalization. Islam is a religion with over a billion followers: trying to make any sort of statement about all of its followers is a fool's errand. I'm reminded of what my religious studies professor said: "There is no such thing as Christianity: there are Christianities". The Christianity of Pope Francis is not the Christianity of the Westboro Baptist Church, and the same holds true for Muslims.

Re: Hacked: Private Messages From Dating Site ‘Muslim Match’

#50

Post by DominikR » Thu, Jun 30, 2016, 3:19 PM UTC

protomyth wrote: post #32

DominikR wrote: post #12

This is clearly a criminal and very evil act that will likely harm many people, not just emotionally but also physically. I wonder how anyone could be so deranged to do something like this. But it is also a cultural problem of these Muslim societies that they actually stone people to death for adultery. This is horrific. If I were to make a dating app then I would outright ban all of these countries because I don't w…

> This is clearly a criminal and very evil act that will likely harm many people, not just emotionally but also physically. I wonder how anyone could be so deranged to do something like this. I would imagine its probably a family member of someone killed in a terrorist attack. Trying to take vengeance against a whole segment of humanity is not unknown.

Which makes him or her no different from the terrorists themselves, though I can understand the suffering if you have lost someone. These are just normal people after all that will be harmed. Some random teenagers sexting in the Middle East.