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Why we challenge Microsoft’s battery test

opera.com

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Re: Why we challenge Microsoft’s battery test

#201

Post by ntoshev »

kylealden wrote: post #91

Edge platform team employee here. A couple thoughts on methodology, focusing on our scripted test (under "stay productive longer" at https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexperience/2016/06/20/more-... ), which is most comparable to Opera's test; nobody seems to challenge our Netflix results: * We did not enable ad blockers, because we were testing the efficiency of the network stack, browser rendering pipeline, etc.; if…

It may not be fair to enable adblocking if you want to compare other engineering components, but these results still mean users in the real world will see more battery time with Opera than with Edge.

Re: Why we challenge Microsoft’s battery test

#202

Post by belorn »

dogma1138 wrote: post #197
anc84 wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would be a whole different test then. Not about efficiency of the browser itself but about what the browser gets served.

The test was which browser gives you the better battery life while browsing the internet like a normal user. Why is a different question and it's not that relevant, I often don't care why something I USE works better I just care that it does. If it something I BUILD then I would care much more but again this is a whole different issue.

Within those specifications, the objection about the ad-block become irrelevant. If the browser justs works better, then users don't care and can simply enjoy more battery time.

The case for more normalized tests is to find out which browser is factually better designed/written.

Re: Why we challenge Microsoft’s battery test

#203

Post by CoryG89 »

JoBrad wrote: post #143
ebbv wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering Microsoft recently added ads to the Windows 10 login screen, I wouldn't hold my breath on Edge coming with an ad blocker out of the box. EDIT: Downvotes? Really this is factually accurate: http://lifehacker.com/windows-10-is-showing-ads-on-your-lock...

The article you linked to specifically talks about how easy it is to turn them off.

OP never claimed it wasn't easy to turn them off.

Re: Why we challenge Microsoft’s battery test

#205

Post by Tloewald »

Aissen wrote: post #185
kylealden wrote: post #91

Edge platform team employee here. A couple thoughts on methodology, focusing on our scripted test (under "stay productive longer" at https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexperience/2016/06/20/more-... ), which is most comparable to Opera's test; nobody seems to challenge our Netflix results: * We did not enable ad blockers, because we were testing the efficiency of the network stack, browser rendering pipeline, etc.; if…

> nobody seems to challenge our Netflix results: Of course, this is Lotus vs Office all over again. You're using the OS advantage (Windows 10 and its DRM platform) to show that you can do things more efficiently. You chose the technology platform (I'm guessing Play Ready), you forced GPU vendors to comply, and now you give competitors a bad reputation for daring to use their own (or a competitor's) technology.

Netflix is a rather specific example — don't they use Silverlight (as in "the only site anyone in the world cares about that uses Silverlight"?)

It's like Apple stressing how well their browser works on -- oh wait, Apple doesn't produce a proprietary plugin. Well, let's say the iTunes page, if it were specifically tuned to work well in Safari.

Re: Why we challenge Microsoft’s battery test

#206

Post by Tloewald »

JulienSchmidt wrote: post #23
adrianN wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The OS is a pretty obvious confounding factor, don't you think?

I think it would still be interesting. Win10 + Edge vs macOS + Safari. In the end the user does not care which OS runs in the background, just which platform offers the best experience - in this case the longest battery time.

There are plenty of suitable comparisons from which one can make an educated guess. In general, Macs do better than comparable Windows machines in browsing endurance tests, and Safari clobbers every other browser it has been tested in for battery life (I have _not_ seen a comparison of Safari to this new version of Opera, but judging by its performance relative to Chrome it could be competitive with Safari).

Safari, of course, has lots of support for ad blocking short of Apple actually doing the ad blocking itself. I suspect Safari + ad blockers would be the best option across the board (it absolutely rocks on iOS devices).

Re: Why we challenge Microsoft’s battery test

#207

Post by drdeca »

breakingcups wrote: post #190
csl wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't need to go to such complicated lengths. Just perform enough tests (as in, a statistically large enough amount) and a distribution will form. That also captures the variability of real world network effects.

What about different ads served to different browsers? Someone running, say, Opera will have a different ad profile than a Chrome user even when completely blank cookie-wise.

Maybe have them give the same user agent?

Re: Why we challenge Microsoft’s battery test

#208

Post by ascagnel_ »

Tloewald wrote: post #205
Aissen wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> nobody seems to challenge our Netflix results: Of course, this is Lotus vs Office all over again. You're using the OS advantage (Windows 10 and its DRM platform) to show that you can do things more efficiently. You chose the technology platform (I'm guessing Play Ready), you forced GPU vendors to comply, and now you give competitors a bad reputation for daring to use their own (or a competitor's) technology.

Netflix is a rather specific example — don't they use Silverlight (as in "the only site anyone in the world cares about that uses Silverlight"?) It's like Apple stressing how well their browser works on -- oh wait, Apple doesn't produce a proprietary plugin. Well, let's say the iTunes page, if it were specifically tuned to work well in Safari.

Edge and Safari run Netflix under HTML5's protected media path. Silverlight is only used for backwards compatibility.

Re: Why we challenge Microsoft’s battery test

#209

Post by bialpio »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #108
LoSboccacc wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yeah it's like comparing MPG of similar cars but Opera test is done in the middle of the night and competitors at rush hour

Your analogy collapses then though because you need people to be able to choose whether to travel at day/night at will for the comparison. Perhaps a better (but still flawed) way would be to say if the Opera browser included a free pass for toll roads and Edge didn't - so with the standard Opera offering you'd be getting a faster journey. The point to me is that the situation is more nuanced than Microsoft apparently…

Well, when you are the person performing the test you can somewhat control the conditions. ;) Opera just chose to drive in the night but sent Edge through rush hour.

Re: Why we challenge Microsoft’s battery test

#210

Post by bialpio »

Retric wrote: post #171
bialpio wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But how is it all relevant to the discussion? Bottom line is that using adblock in one browser and not using it in other browser makes the comparisons meaningless...

People are objecting to add blocking as a perfectly normal browser feature. There is a mindset that as soon as people start wearing augmented reality glasses they are going to want context sensitive advertising in their day to day lives. IMO, most people would much rather block real world adds and overlay them with blank space or even nature scenes. Browser advertising fits into the same argument as adds on cable tel…

Let me reiterate as you did not address anything from my comment: But how is it all relevant to the discussion? Bottom line is that using adblock in one browser and not using it in other browser makes the comparisons meaningless...
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