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Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

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Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#211

Post by ergothus »

russdill wrote: post #155
ergothus wrote: post #26

I've been a vegetarian for the last decade and change, and I simultaneously think that finding a cheaper, appealing alternative to meat is both a fantastic opportunity for the world and a really difficult thing. I used to love meat when I was a meat-eater, and I'm a fairly picky eater that dislikes many vegetable options. (Green peppers are nasty and food-destroying in my opinion, which immediately removes over half…

To be fair, if you give someone and tell them it's a chicken nugget, you are setting the bar pretty low. People have come to expect pretty much any quality of meat and even texture in a chicken nugget.

Absolutely. I don't think we've gotten very close in matching "meat", but we're pretty close to the nugget/pink slime/McDonalds burger line.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#212

Post by hiou »

mindslight wrote: post #74
ergothus wrote: post #26

I've been a vegetarian for the last decade and change, and I simultaneously think that finding a cheaper, appealing alternative to meat is both a fantastic opportunity for the world and a really difficult thing. I used to love meat when I was a meat-eater, and I'm a fairly picky eater that dislikes many vegetable options. (Green peppers are nasty and food-destroying in my opinion, which immediately removes over half…

The way I see it, selling anything to meat eaters as a "meat equivalent" is setting it up for rejection. I'd bet that if you took even real meat and told people it was "fake", a good portion of them would reject it as somehow weird. The "burger" is just a convenient form factor. Each kind is really its own thing, with its own taste and mouthfeel. It needs to be tried and appreciated as such, or disappointment is inev…

But does that change if the fake is $3 and the real one is $15? I think a lot of people in the front end of these startups trying to create almost identical to meat and dairy products are looking at that possibility in the not so far future as to why they will be successful. As opposed to something like a boca burger that is more intended to fit inside a hamburger bun as opposed to being exactly like meat.

I say this as someone who hasn't eaten meat for well over a decade and a really close meat substitute sounds gross.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#213

Post by PerfectElement »

I think most people are already 95% vegan, since they are against causing unnecessary suffering and inefficient resource management. The issue is that there's a variable level of sacrifice that goes into making a practical transition to plants.

For some, there's enough motivation to do it; for others, the inconvenience of changing habits and their emotional attachment to certain foods are greater than their desire to reduce animal suffering and environmental degradation.

I hope that plant meats become so close to animal meat that the complete experience can be replicated, except for the slaughtering. I know some people like the slaughtering part, but that's a small minority.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#214

Post by maerF0x0 »

pombrand wrote: post #168
bradbeattie wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm in the same camp as you. Vegetarian since 1989, vegan since 1999. I can certainly say that the quality of fake meats has drastically improved in the past 10 years (see https://gardein.com/ , http://fieldroast.com/ , and http://beyondmeat.com/ as examples), but the stigma surrounding them persists. Short anecdote: There's a donut shop in my town that sold vegan and regular donuts in adjacent but separate displays.…

Huge problem with the vegan meat replacements is that they're a lot more expensive than beef, around $7/lb vs ground beef at $3/lb. Like with coal vs solar, for imitation meat to win the market it needs to get less expensive than real meat (and taste as good).

Or the subsidies that hide the facts. Beef is very expensive in the sense of TCO, but not that expensive at the grocery store. See: http://michaelpollan.com/profiles/the-high-price-of-cheap-fo... for a good read on the matter.

a snip:

"The industrial food chain does produce food more cheaply, in terms of the price you pay at McDonald’s or the supermarket,” replies Pollan, “but the real cost of cheap food is not reflected in those prices. You’re paying for it in your tax dollars because you’re giving farmers $20 billion a year in subsidies. You’re paying for it in public health costs. These subsidies make unhealthy food cheaper than healthy food, and so our country is facing an obesity epidemic."

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#215

Post by stonemetal »

delecti wrote: post #89
ergothus wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a huge fan of Indian food. (Because it's tasty, AND because they are one of the few foreign countries that uses the same definition of "vegetarian" that I do). That said, I actually have a fairly limited range there too: if you don't like yogurt, dill, bell peppers, cucumbers, or okra, a lot gets cut out. That's on me an my tastes, not the Indian food, but it's still a reality I have to deal with.

> the same definition of "vegetarian" that I do Can you elaborate?

In japan seafood isn't considered meat. If you do then it can be pretty hard.

Also, as far as I understand, they don't use a lot of vegetable oil. So things that would be ok in the west, like bread, more than likely have lard in them.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#216

Post by nostrebored »

amalag wrote: post #162
wil421 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not a vegetarian but I do go out with many Indian colleagues who are vegetarian and have family members or friends who dont eat meat. I do agree with the assumption that western vegetarians tend to want meat replacements. The biggest difference for me was seeing how a lot of Indian cuisine is actually unhealthy. Most everything is fried in oil or has so much clarified butter its unhealthy. The Indian diet (at least t…

Traditional Indian food is perfectly healthy. Fresh vegetables, grains, etc. Even clarified butter used to be prepared differently.

People still think that oil and butter are bad for you, despite the mountains of research that saturated fat is not unhealthy, and the new research regarding weight loss that the high fat Mediterranean diet is better than low fat diets.

The only reasonable complaints re Indian food are high carbs and low amounts of high quality protein

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#217

Post by maerF0x0 »

bcheung wrote: post #207

I wish they kept the fat. I try to eat Paleo / Ketogenic and it is so hard to find quality fat in foods because of an unjustified fear of fat. Cholesterol is correlated with health issues in the same way that firemen are correlated with fires. It's not a causal relationship.

You could add fat yourself quite easily. Coconut oil/butter for example.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#218

Post by PerfectElement »

ergothus wrote: post #26

I've been a vegetarian for the last decade and change, and I simultaneously think that finding a cheaper, appealing alternative to meat is both a fantastic opportunity for the world and a really difficult thing. I used to love meat when I was a meat-eater, and I'm a fairly picky eater that dislikes many vegetable options. (Green peppers are nasty and food-destroying in my opinion, which immediately removes over half…

I've been vegan for over 10 years and I like where things are going.

My favorite dishes don't contain mock meats (when I went vegan they didn't exist where I used to live, so I just got used to eating lots of legumes, whole grains and tubers), but it's fun to try these foods once in a while.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#219

Post by douche »

pombrand wrote: post #168
bradbeattie wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm in the same camp as you. Vegetarian since 1989, vegan since 1999. I can certainly say that the quality of fake meats has drastically improved in the past 10 years (see https://gardein.com/ , http://fieldroast.com/ , and http://beyondmeat.com/ as examples), but the stigma surrounding them persists. Short anecdote: There's a donut shop in my town that sold vegan and regular donuts in adjacent but separate displays.…

Huge problem with the vegan meat replacements is that they're a lot more expensive than beef, around $7/lb vs ground beef at $3/lb. Like with coal vs solar, for imitation meat to win the market it needs to get less expensive than real meat (and taste as good).

Pork is even cheaper, for some reason. I've been buying boneless pork chops for something like $1 - $1.50 /pound for years from Market Basket stores.

Re: Bloody Plant Burger Smells, Tastes and Sizzles Like Meat

#220

Post by maerF0x0 »

PerfectElement wrote: post #197
maerF0x0 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Omega3 - Omega 6 ratio in fats (more omega 3 is better) may be healthier. It seems that grass fed beef has better ratios http://www.mercola.com/beef/health_benefits.htm I'm regularly surprised by how little the average person knows about the things that make/keep them healthy. If I really wanted a car to last I'd be sure I knew all about the gasoline and oil I was putting into it.

There is always a link to Dr. Mercola's articles when people try to defend the health benefits of eating meat, but no one mentions that is an anti-vaxxer and has many other unscientific claims on his website.

It was just the first hit in google tbh and I already knew it to be true, just needed a link to attempt to satisfy haters.

Seeing as you'd rather attack than do some useful work, I'll do it for you. See below:

"A healthy diet should consist of roughly one to four times more omega-6 fatty acids than omega-3 fatty acids. The typical American diet tends to contain 11 to 30 times more omega -6 fatty acids than omega -3, a phenomenon that has been hypothesized as a significant factor in the rising rate of inflammatory disorders in the United States[40]. Table ​Table22 shows significant differences in n-6:n-3 ratios between grass-fed and grain-fed beef, with and overall average of 1.53 and 7.65 for grass-fed and grain-fed, respectively, for all studies reported in this review."[1]

[1]: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2846864/

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