Live data from Hacker News

American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

theatlantic.com

191–200 of 300 posts

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#191
I am not sure that the author isn't confusing America's wealth disparity with differential treatment of intelligence (which still seems to remain undefined).

Sure, those with high SAT scores have greater access to the means for economic success, but I don't think that is because of any intrinsic difference in high-SATers and the run of the mill dummy. Rather, I'd suggest it is due to the winner-take-all nature of the current American society.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#192

Are you guys living in the same world that I am? Nerdy geek-type intellectuals are at the BOTTOM of the totem pole in terms of respect and human worth in the 21st century. They are ostracized, bullied in school, most are awkward virgins (intellect is the anti-thesis when it comes to being a "womanizer" or "stud") and it's only getting worse as society progresses.

Are you living in the same world as the rest of us? Sure, there are people who fulfill the stereotype that you've repeated here. But among the nerdy people I've known you'll find some great people with rich, full lives. People who spend their work lives searching for evidence of dark matter can also climb mountains and have great family lives. Telemetry engineers who spend their days working on RF systems can spend t…

This is an all too common occurrence with "nerds" such as yourself on Hacker News: You are perhaps intelligent and high IQ. You are perhaps a successful telemetry engineer, yet you are BLIND when it comes to even a BASIC understanding how everything operates socially.

Raw intelligence by itself, is scoffed at by the general population. Outside of your tight knit nerd-circle or a back office server room in Silicon Valley, nobody actually cares about your quirky radio-frequency system hobby. Not even your boss cares, he just wants you to bust your back to help turn a profit.

On a social level, athletes and high-school football jocks take higher precedence than you. Pop musicians take higher precedence than you. Actors take higher precedence than you. Your local handsome extroverted bartender who can't even operate a computer takes a higher precedence than you (especially in the eyes of ovulating women) That is what human-worth means, in the 21st century.

Sorry guys. The show is over. Perhaps in the near future high-IQ nerds will finally engineer fully immersive virtual world(s), because that will be only world they will ever get any respect.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#193
post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you just pointed out the problem with vocational education. Going to law school is a vocational education, as is getting an education to become a mechanic. Vocational educations take years (sometimes almost a decade) to complete. From the time you start your vocational education to the time you finish it, the market can drastically change (see Law and nursing). That lucrative job that you thought was waiting…

Yes, mechanics to build the machines to repair them in a fully automatic fashion. For a thought experiment on this, check out http://thelightsinthetunnel.com/ which explores the idea that eventually humans will stop inventing because we'll have everything we need

But we wont need that many mechanics, probably just the really good ones (because there is now less demand))

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#194
post #105

As a non-American, and so 'judging' America only through the media, it does feel like the complete opposite. Deep ingrained anti-intellectualism, idolization of stupidity and love of the brazen and the rich. Scary decline of the sciences and rapid expansion of superstitions. Of course this does not apply to this here readership, but at least from an outside perspective we see 'idiocracy' surging onto the stage at bre…

Your assessments are not consistent with facts. You imply that the media is a distorting lens, but then you go on to espouse views that come entirely from the media. I'm not sure I understand that. The US is becoming less religious, and it is the least religious it has ever been. People aren't increasingly idolizing stupidity or loving the rich, or Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders wouldn't have done as well as they di…

The US may be becoming less religious but there's a clear and growing trend of anti-intellectualism. Look at the anti-vaccine movement as an example. It has managed to convince many people that vaccines are risky, which is directly contrary to all scientific evidence.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#195
post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you just pointed out the problem with vocational education. Going to law school is a vocational education, as is getting an education to become a mechanic. Vocational educations take years (sometimes almost a decade) to complete. From the time you start your vocational education to the time you finish it, the market can drastically change (see Law and nursing). That lucrative job that you thought was waiting…

Yes, mechanics to build the machines to repair them in a fully automatic fashion. For a thought experiment on this, check out http://thelightsinthetunnel.com/ which explores the idea that eventually humans will stop inventing because we'll have everything we need

Interesting premise, if not exactly novel, but some could argue that, excepting some needed advances in medicine, we do have everything we need and we're still not satisfied. It comes down to this, will humanity ever design/invent something universally recognized as being perfect? I don't think so, I will still try to check out the book though.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#196
post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nordic countries have very high taxes("taking away one's fruits of labor"), and manage to do well.

Shut the fuck up! The hivemind is speaking . Non-neoliberal perspectives are terrible and advocacy for them will be punished by context-free links and downvotes.

There is a very vigorous balance between liberal and libertarian views on HN, and both sides tend to (mostly) strive toward thoughtful discussion.

Please take this sort of thing to Reddit where it belongs.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#197
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Human worth is intrinsic and absolute. It depends on nothing and is granted simply for existing. It cannot be taken away. The commission of crimes will result in a loss of freedoms and rights, but not human worth. Economic value however is not meaningless. It represents a measure of contribution to the capital engine that powers our lives. The whole system however is completely unfair and biased since the actual econ…

>> Human worth is intrinsic and absolute. Do you have a citation?

They are intrinsic and absolute within the construct of human society.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends on why they aren't working. If they have no capital, and no pension they better be in a protected class, like students, seniors, disabled, single mothers with children or be very attractive. Otherwise there is almost no financial support coming their way in the United States, except for a meager food ration that has to be primarily carbohydrates, and basic health care. Everyone will hate them, they will be ch…

Most of the non-working are the poor. 60% of the poor don't work at all, and 89% don't work full time. See table 3. http://www.census.gov/content/dam/Census/library/publication... Are you claiming that there are more than 15.6 million non-working rich people? What do you mean by "rich"? Also, 45% of poor people own their own home. Who is evicting them, the taxman? http://www.census.gov/prod/2008pubs/h150-07.pdf Lastl…

60% of the poor don't collect income reportable on a w2 form. That does not mean they do not engage in productive activities that produce cash.

There is a huge informal cash and barter economy of legal goods, and another one for illegal goods.

And yes, the tax man will sell your home out from under you in a tax sale if you do not pay property taxes for long enough.

All of us live under a sword of damocles in regards to cash flow. You gotta keep putting quarters in the meter to live in modern capitalism.

I define rich as those who have sufficient wealth in financial instruments and assets such as treasury bonds and equities to pay for their lifestyle without the need to collect 1099 or w2 income.

They are the only ones who truly do not work, the only ones who can truly sit back and relax. They are the real loafers, the true moochers, and the laziest of all classes of society, I also have the ambition to become one myself, but I will have no pretensions that I would be engaged in anything other than having found a way to have others serve me, no different than any lord or pharoah or emperor, and in fact with much greater security and ease.

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But the Big Bang Theory show is Reverse-Anti-intellectualism.

The Big Biang Theiry is "nerdface." The audience is lsughing at the characters, not with them.

The balance of the emotional attachment is positive so..

Re: American society increasingly mistakes intelligence for human worth

#200
A terrible thing about society today is our diminishing ability for self-reflection (which is a form of emotional intelligence). Most of the stuff we do as individuals is driven by marketing and social pressure - So much so that many of us have become oblivious to our true internal needs. Maybe that's why so many people go to psychologists nowadays.

In the past, people put more value on self-reflection, philosophical thinking and other types of emotional intelligence (e.g. wisdom) over raw I.Q.

Post reply on HN