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OS X is now macOS and gets support for Siri, auto unlock

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Re: OS X is now macOS and gets support for Siri, auto unlock

#551

Post by cyphar »

jordigh wrote: post #434
netheril96 wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> because Apple's popularity is sending some message that GPLv3 is poisonous Doesn't Linus' refusal of GPL3 damage its reputation much greater than Apple?

The Linux devs publicly denounced an early draft of GPLv3 and never reconsidered the question. Yeah, I think they just didn't feel like trying to understand it, and Linus's own anti-FSF attitude spreads to his followers.

Actually Linus didn't have any big problems with one of the GPLv3 drafts[1]. And many bits of the Linux kernel are individually licensed as GPLv2+. Not to mention that Linus used to have in COPYING that they were considering updating. Very few kernel developers hate GPLv3.

[1] http://www.computerworld.com/article/2544276/network-softwar...

Re: OS X is now macOS and gets support for Siri, auto unlock

#552

Post by zepto »

cyphar wrote: post #546
legodt wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Designer here. I and a lot of my colleagues love open source and what it stands for, but, the truth is, it is going to be very difficult to convert designers into hardcore open source advocates like coders/engineers can be when the tools we rely on every day are all closed source. Adobe creative suite, Rhino, proprietary render engines, and a bunch of other platforms designers use simply don't have open source altern…

> The majority of the professional community for creating UX/UI do not have the tools to work in FOSS, so you aren't going to see many designers working for FOSS projects as result Then put a call out for what tools you need replaced. Maybe even back GNU to hire people to do it. As a free software developer, I have no clue what you need in order to do good design work. From my perspective, inkscape works "good enough…

This sounds like a good encapsulation of the reason why Desktop Linux has died - it is good enough for engineering types who get satisfaction and value out of using it, but who have no idea how to make it useful for anyone outside of the programming community.

Re: OS X is now macOS and gets support for Siri, auto unlock

#553

Post by zepto »

partiallypro wrote: post #311
JustSomeNobody wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's already a great desktop OS. And they did announce some things (file system) that will make it even better.

OSX used to be ahead of the curve though compared to Windows, now...it's falling behind. I think that's where people's frustrations come from.

Falling behind how?

Re: OS X is now macOS and gets support for Siri, auto unlock

#554

Post by groovy2shoes »

tylerflick wrote: post #242
nothis wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like Apple's mobile devices but ever since the iPad turned out to be a giant iPhone instead of a true desktop/mobile hybrid, I'm scared as hell that they will lock down their desktop/laptop ecosystem the way they do with mobile. It's clear now that iOS is absorbing everything Mac. Now I'm trapped between MacOS, Windows 10 and maybe Google's Chrome environment. Linux, please take off. I wished the open source commun…

There are some really great UI/UI designers out there for Linux distros. Check out https://numixproject.org/ .

Just because some UI looks pretty doesn't mean it's well-designed. I sat there staring at that page for like 2 minutes, trying to figure out where I was supposed to click to get more information, before I realized I had to scroll down. Perhaps I'm old-fashioned, but I don't consider that good UI.

Re: OS X is now macOS and gets support for Siri, auto unlock

#555

Post by cyphar »

zepto wrote: post #552
cyphar wrote: post #546

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The majority of the professional community for creating UX/UI do not have the tools to work in FOSS, so you aren't going to see many designers working for FOSS projects as result Then put a call out for what tools you need replaced. Maybe even back GNU to hire people to do it. As a free software developer, I have no clue what you need in order to do good design work. From my perspective, inkscape works "good enough…

This sounds like a good encapsulation of the reason why Desktop Linux has died - it is good enough for engineering types who get satisfaction and value out of using it, but who have no idea how to make it useful for anyone outside of the programming community.

That's not really a fair statement. Desktop GNU/Linux works for people who don't have incredibly specific requirements (like "Inkscape isn't enough, I have this $5000 software suite that nobody has replaced with free software yet").

LibreOffice + {Gnome,KDE} + {Chrome,Firefox} is enough for quite a few users "outside of the programming community". My girlfriend uses GNU/Linux (she has to use Windows now because my university requires some proprietary CAD software that I don't want to set up with WINE), several of my non-technical friends now use GNU/Linux.

It's dishonest to claim that just because some professional designers aren't happy with the tools we have available right now on GNU/Linux that "Desktop Linux has died because programmers have no idea how to make it useful for anyone outside that community".

I would downvote you if I could.

Re: OS X is now macOS and gets support for Siri, auto unlock

#556

Post by ashitlerferad »

legodt wrote: post #235
nothis wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like Apple's mobile devices but ever since the iPad turned out to be a giant iPhone instead of a true desktop/mobile hybrid, I'm scared as hell that they will lock down their desktop/laptop ecosystem the way they do with mobile. It's clear now that iOS is absorbing everything Mac. Now I'm trapped between MacOS, Windows 10 and maybe Google's Chrome environment. Linux, please take off. I wished the open source commun…

Designer here. I and a lot of my colleagues love open source and what it stands for, but, the truth is, it is going to be very difficult to convert designers into hardcore open source advocates like coders/engineers can be when the tools we rely on every day are all closed source. Adobe creative suite, Rhino, proprietary render engines, and a bunch of other platforms designers use simply don't have open source altern…

FLOSS always has to start somewhere and there are definitely professional artists and designers that use the existing FLOSS tools.

During the day, do your work with the tools you are used to. During the night, share a few design tips with open source folks and try out the FLOSS tools.

Re: OS X is now macOS and gets support for Siri, auto unlock

#557

Post by elcritch »

cyphar wrote: post #548
snuxoll wrote: post #400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I swear, I must be the only person on the planet satisfied with the current state of systemd and GNOME 3. Fedora 23 is my main workstation OS and I have the least amount of friction getting my work done on it compared to either Windows or macOS these days. Then again, I mostly spend my day in IntelliJ, DataGrip, PyCharm, Firefox, a terminal, and a Windows VM for when I'm forced to open Visual Studio.

I'm a maintainer of runC and long-term contributor to Docker. From my perspective, systemd has been nothing but a huge pain from a development perspective. Not because of the UX (which is okay, there's lots of odd stuff there too) but because systemd sets up the system in a way that is ridiculously frustrating for people using low-level kernel primitives directly. If you want to use cgroups and don't want systemd to…

I concur as a user of Docker. Trying to get a legacy application running on Docker went smoothly. That is until I tried to start a simple rpcbind service and discovered that during my time away from software development and linux that systemd had taken over plain old kludgy (but hackable!) sysV init scripts. Trying to get a dead simple service running took hours because systemd segfaults instead of gracefully handling and reporting errors. In this case, cgroups wasn't mounted, though why a system init system has a hard requirement on a relatively new kernel feature set not needed in this situation, I can't fathom. Eventually I found a shim for cgroups, but seriously it was a pain. I lost half a night's sleep due to shoddy system level programming you mention from systemd. I'm currently highly eager for FreeBSD 11.0 to reach code freeze. It has a new Docker / linux64 layer and _no_ systemd.

Re: OS X is now macOS and gets support for Siri, auto unlock

#558

Post by cyphar »

elcritch wrote: post #557
cyphar wrote: post #548

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a maintainer of runC and long-term contributor to Docker. From my perspective, systemd has been nothing but a huge pain from a development perspective. Not because of the UX (which is okay, there's lots of odd stuff there too) but because systemd sets up the system in a way that is ridiculously frustrating for people using low-level kernel primitives directly. If you want to use cgroups and don't want systemd to…

I concur as a user of Docker. Trying to get a legacy application running on Docker went smoothly. That is until I tried to start a simple rpcbind service and discovered that during my time away from software development and linux that systemd had taken over plain old kludgy (but hackable!) sysV init scripts. Trying to get a dead simple service running took hours because systemd segfaults instead of gracefully handlin…

> I'm currently highly eager for FreeBSD 11.0 to reach code freeze. It has a new Docker / linux64 layer and _no_ systemd.

For what it's worth, if you find a distro that doesn't have systemd you can run Docker and runC on it -- both use the underlying kernel primitives themselves and aren't wrappers for systemd scripts.

Re: OS X is now macOS and gets support for Siri, auto unlock

#559

Post by PhantomGremlin »

xxr wrote: post #43

Will they likely be moving to major version increments for each named release? Since it's no longer "OS 10," will Sierra be macOS 11, and the named release after it macOS12, and so on?

MY prediction is that Sierra will be aka macOS 10.12.

Starting next year we will have iOS 11 and macOS 11. That way the numbers are unified.

Re: OS X is now macOS and gets support for Siri, auto unlock

#560

Post by digi_owl »

cyphar wrote: post #555
zepto wrote: post #552

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sounds like a good encapsulation of the reason why Desktop Linux has died - it is good enough for engineering types who get satisfaction and value out of using it, but who have no idea how to make it useful for anyone outside of the programming community.

That's not really a fair statement. Desktop GNU/Linux works for people who don't have incredibly specific requirements (like "Inkscape isn't enough, I have this $5000 software suite that nobody has replaced with free software yet"). LibreOffice + {Gnome,KDE} + {Chrome,Firefox} is enough for quite a few users "outside of the programming community". My girlfriend uses GNU/Linux (she has to use Windows now because my un…

Yeah i think the problem for Linux on the desktop is not software but hardware.

More specifically the issue of getting preinstalled Linux out on store shelves right next to Windows and OSX.

In large part because there is no marketing machine to match Apple available, nor the deep pockets to get into a war of attrition with Microsoft.

The closest we came was when Asus shipped their original EEEPC. And Microsoft wasted no time offering a specialized license for Windows XP so that OEMs could offer it instead. Keep in mind that MS had stopped offering XP, and was trying to sell Vista at the time.

On top of that most stores have gotten damn used to the Apple MS duopoly. Thus anything thats not an Apple is a MS, with all the customer support problems that entails...

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