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Microsoft is cutting 1,000 jobs in Finland as it stops phone production

uk.businessinsider.com

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Re: Microsoft is cutting 1,000 jobs in Finland as it stops phone production

#161

Post by x0x0 »

Grishnakh wrote: post #159
x0x0 wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because every android manufacturer will end with virtually no profit since they are producing a commodity. When you basically can't differentiate with your software except for which shitty skin you layered on top of Android, what makes a samsung better than an lg or any other android device?

This is rather ignorant. Hardware is what makes Samsungs (for example) better: superAMOLED screens (which iPhones still don't have), better cameras, waterproof cases, removable batteries, etc. Can you drop your crappy iPhone in the pool? No, but a Galaxy S5 can handle that with no trouble, while having a better screen, removable battery, and upgradable SD card storage.

Yeah, but no. There's nothing stopping Huawei or anyone else from exactly copying that Samsung. And then what's the difference between the two? Nothing except price.

OTOH, nobody can copy an iphone because nobody but apple can put ios on a phone.

Re: Microsoft is cutting 1,000 jobs in Finland as it stops phone production

#162

Post by Grishnakh »

x0x0 wrote: post #161
Grishnakh wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is rather ignorant. Hardware is what makes Samsungs (for example) better: superAMOLED screens (which iPhones still don't have), better cameras, waterproof cases, removable batteries, etc. Can you drop your crappy iPhone in the pool? No, but a Galaxy S5 can handle that with no trouble, while having a better screen, removable battery, and upgradable SD card storage.

Yeah, but no. There's nothing stopping Huawei or anyone else from exactly copying that Samsung. And then what's the difference between the two? Nothing except price. OTOH, nobody can copy an iphone because nobody but apple can put ios on a phone.

The problem with that idea is that if Huawei really could copy the Samsung, then why haven't they? I'd love to see more phones up to Samsung's specs, but I'm not seeing any. Heck, I'd love to see Samsung make a phone to those specs again (the S6 was crap and the S7 still doesn't have a user-replaceable battery though at least they finally put waterproofing back in).

The other difference is quality. I have no faith Huawei can make a phone at Samsung's quality level. Where are they going to get the screen from anyway? Or the camera? Those components aren't easy to copy; those things are state-of-the-art.

Finally, even Apple can't copy Samsung. They still have crappy screens, though the next iPhone is finally supposed to be getting a superAMOLED screen. WTF took them so long? Simple: Apple isn't a hardware manufacturer, they have to contract stuff out, whereas Samsung is a hardware maker, and makes state-of-the-art screens themselves.

Re: Microsoft is cutting 1,000 jobs in Finland as it stops phone production

#163

Post by chflags »

dang wrote: post #160
chflags wrote: post #90

"... linux laptops were being reformatted to run windows." Microsoft/Windows is a cancer. Ballmer once said Linux was a cancer. He later retracted, after it was well-known Microsoft itself uses Linux. There's nothing more pathetic than when you see Microsoft's businesspeople or lawyers at conferences all faithfully using Windows, as if there was no other choice, and rambling on about how their products can solve any…

This comment breaks the HN guidelines by calling names. Please don't do that on this site. The old-fashioned technology flamewar is one of the things we're trying to avoid here, regardless of how one feels about Microsoft etc. We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11770051 and marked it off-topic.

OP: "... cemented them as assholes in my mind."

That's "name-calling".

But I understand the need to detach the silly hyperbolic responses my comment triggered. I was not expecting those.

Please accept my apologies for any incomvenience I may have caused.

Re: Microsoft is cutting 1,000 jobs in Finland as it stops phone production

#164

Post by Grishnakh »

fsloth wrote: post #135
chflags wrote: post #90

"... linux laptops were being reformatted to run windows." Microsoft/Windows is a cancer. Ballmer once said Linux was a cancer. He later retracted, after it was well-known Microsoft itself uses Linux. There's nothing more pathetic than when you see Microsoft's businesspeople or lawyers at conferences all faithfully using Windows, as if there was no other choice, and rambling on about how their products can solve any…

Is your argument that Microsoft is evil because not all people who use computers are actually interested in how they work? It's not apparent to me why business people or lawyers should be also computer science aficionados. Should I be a telecoms engineer to use a phone or a combustion specialist to drive a car?

I think the idea is MS employees are hamstrung by having to use an inferior OS because it's the one their employer makes. It's like being a Honda employee who needs to tow a heavy load for some company project, and while a big Ford diesel F-350 would be perfect for the job, you're not allowed to use that and have to use a Honda Ridgeline instead, but the load is beyond the Ridgeline's towing capacity so you either have to use two Ridgelines (which is probably illegal and technically difficult), or just overload one Ridgeline (which is both illegal and very dangerous). Or, you're an employee of Freightliner, and you need to go buy something from a local business, but you have to use a company vehicle. But the company vehicles are all Freightliner semi-tractors, and they don't have any regular cars in their fleet because they don't make cars. So you're expected to drive a semi-tractor to some local business to pick up something, and the local business doesn't even have a parking lot large enough for you to get the truck in.

Best tool for the job, and all that. Now arguably, Windows is indeed the best tool for business type people working at MS, due to the application software, the network environment they're in, etc.. However, for researchers doing heavy computing, I would say it's definitely not, it's quite inferior. There's a reason most of the supercomputers, render farms, etc. now run Linux, and it's not just license cost.

Re: Microsoft is cutting 1,000 jobs in Finland as it stops phone production

#165

Post by Teckla »

x0x0 wrote: post #144
twblalock wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes you think Nokia would have ended up like Samsung/Motorola/HTC rather than Xiaomi/Huawei/etc? Nokia at least had a chance to be one of the profitable ones.

Because every android manufacturer will end with virtually no profit since they are producing a commodity. When you basically can't differentiate with your software except for which shitty skin you layered on top of Android, what makes a samsung better than an lg or any other android device?

Because every android manufacturer will end with virtually no profit since they are producing a commodity. When you basically can't differentiate with your software except for which shitty skin you layered on top of Android, what makes a samsung better than an lg or any other android device?

Updates. Updates, updates, updates.

I've come to trust Apple. Why? Because my iPad 2 still gets OS and security updates. Because my iPhone 5s still gets OS and security updates.

Apple has demonstrated that they support their tablets and phones at least 4 or 5 years. That's why I'll buy another Apple tablet. That's why I'll buy another Apple phone.

Why would I buy an Android phone or tablet that's unsupported and abandoned after less than two years in many cases? Where security updates (think Stagefright) take months and months to get patched, if they ever get patched at all on your device? Android devices simply aren't safe.

Even the Nexus devices can't compete with Apple on longevity of support.

Android manufacturers could convince me to try their products if they'd simply patch them in a reasonable time and update them for a reasonable amount of time. I would define reasonable as at least 4 full years after purchase. For that, I'd pay Apple like premiums.

Until that time comes, my only viable option is Apple.

Re: Microsoft is cutting 1,000 jobs in Finland as it stops phone production

#166

Post by Grishnakh »

user11768536 wrote: post #77
pjmlp wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe they don't want to loose their face? You should follow this tweeter discussion from Sinofsky https://twitter.com/stevesi/status/733699065763004416 It wasn't the difference between desktop and mobile stacks that pushed most away, rather the breaking changes between WP 7, WP 8, WP 8.1 and WP 10. As explained recently on the Ars Technica article, http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2016/05/onecor... And…

>And as a developer I cannot really get why WP 10 is still so buggy (according to the reports) versus the already stable 8.1. Microsoft eliminated QA as a job role and laid off all of its QA staff in 2014, with rather predictable consequences for both Windows 10 and WP 10. Plenty of articles about it if you Google around. If anything, it's surprising that things have turned out as well for them as they have.

They really did that?

It does make sense, though. QA teams cost a lot of money, and don't produce anything at all. They're a cost center. The only thing they do is keep your quality up so that customers don't get mad and leave.

MS doesn't have to worry about that. People weren't buying WinPhone anyway, and no one's going to abandon Windows (PC OS) because of bugginess. So using the users as beta-testers makes perfect sense for them. If you don't like it, then don't buy MS products.

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