How Technology Hijacks People’s Minds • Hacker News Board

Re: How Technology Hijacks People’s Minds

#281

Post by antognini » Fri, May 20, 2016, 9:28 PM UTC

kefka wrote: post #125

knowaveragejoe wrote: post #49

One nitpick: maybe it's just the grocery stores near me, but the Pharmacies are almost always located near the front right by where you walk in. Milk is often in the back however.

Milk in the back or side makes sense though. The milk and dairy area is usually front-facing doors from the huge walk-in refrigerator. It wouldn't be smart to put a huge walk-in fridge in the center or front of the store, given the recurring shipments from cold storage trucks to fridge. ... However locally, our Kroger(s) has a small case that holds 15 gallons of milk, and a shelf of common bread up front and center.

There was an interesting episode on Planet Money a little while back about why milk is in the back of a supermarket. They had two people give very different explanations: Russ Roberts (an economist) argued that it was just simpler to maintain the cold chain with milk (and meat) in the back of the store since that's where trucks unload, and Michael Pollan (a food writer) argued that it was a behavioral economics trick to make people walk through the whole store.

That said, I've also noticed that in many larger store they have a small case of frequently bought perishables at the front of the store.

http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2014/07/23/334076398/episo...

Re: How Technology Hijacks People’s Minds

#282

Post by kennethologist » Fri, May 20, 2016, 9:29 PM UTC

lars wrote: post #30

Wow, I'm glad this was posted. I think the way we use technology today will be looked back on the same way we look back at naive cigarette smoking in the 1950s. Modern app design isn't about creating things that are good for the user, but about creating want in the user. This is a problem. For example, there are several studies showing that using Facebook in general makes people less happy. User happiness just happen…

Any books you would recommend for reading about these techniques?

Re: How Technology Hijacks People’s Minds

#283

Post by andrepd » Fri, May 20, 2016, 9:30 PM UTC

rm_-rf_slash wrote: post #35

lars wrote: post #30

Wow, I'm glad this was posted. I think the way we use technology today will be looked back on the same way we look back at naive cigarette smoking in the 1950s. Modern app design isn't about creating things that are good for the user, but about creating want in the user. This is a problem. For example, there are several studies showing that using Facebook in general makes people less happy. User happiness just happen…

I think the more apt metaphor is lead in Roman pipes. They knew lead exposure made you crazy but they still used it in their pipes, on their plates - and it drove them mad. After the planet has warmed beyond a point of no return, after antibiotic resistant bacteria make routine surgery a life-or-death decision, after we have squandered away our resources and used what little we had left to wage futile wars, we will f…

Have you a source on that avoid the Romans?

Re: How Technology Hijacks People’s Minds

#284

Post by greggman » Fri, May 20, 2016, 9:31 PM UTC

bikamonki wrote: post #18

Does anyone else feel the slot machine effect here on HN is the karma displayed on the top-right? After a submission or comment, is that number the first thing you check when you come back to the site?

I have wished for a way to turn that number off. (yes, I could make an extension to hide it I guess)

Re: How Technology Hijacks People’s Minds

#285

Post by grillvogel » Fri, May 20, 2016, 9:32 PM UTC

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #212

grillvogel wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the goal is for google to tell you what reality is ?

Not necessarily Google, but yes some amalgamation of technology. Your senses are staggeringly limited and your brain is a mess when it comes to determining what is "real" or not. We use technology to fill the gaps. That's what technology is for - to allow us "see", interact with and influence the world through discrete and explicit measurement in ways our biological systems can't. How is that not the dream? Augmentin…

are you a super villain?

Re: How Technology Hijacks People’s Minds

#286

Post by eellpp » Fri, May 20, 2016, 9:33 PM UTC

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #212

grillvogel wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the goal is for google to tell you what reality is ?

Not necessarily Google, but yes some amalgamation of technology. Your senses are staggeringly limited and your brain is a mess when it comes to determining what is "real" or not. We use technology to fill the gaps. That's what technology is for - to allow us "see", interact with and influence the world through discrete and explicit measurement in ways our biological systems can't. How is that not the dream? Augmentin…

> Your senses are staggeringly limited ... when it comes to determining what is "real" or not.We use technology to fill the gaps. That's what technology is for - to allow us "see", interact with and influence the world through discrete and explicit measurement in ways our biological systems can't.

Sense perception to understand reality or to seek pleasure ? When we pick the phone to play a game, is that interacting with reality or with pure imagination. Same with the round about action of liking each others or seeing what new experience you posted etc.

Sense perception can be used for survival and pleasure. In the game of evolution the latter will get phase out and former will evolve. However in short term, where there is a great economic incentive to game the "pleasure seeking senses" for creating wants and consumption, there would be short term pain and confusion in masses. The question to ask ourself is that whether i succumb to this enticement or just move and let it meet its eventual end.

Country, companies are higher order concepts that lasts over generation. This lets them experiment over many people life and adjust accordingly. But we as an individual we have limited time and space constraint. Its only our mind that can help distinguish the chaff from grain and live a meaningful life.

> Augmenting and eventually replacing our biological capabilities with robust, high precision systems is the ultimate goal.

This was also true when wheel was invented. The purpose of technology is to help in getting things done. The pleasure seeking, sensory perception is just a distraction. And for many of us, the ultimate goal is to live a better life by reducing these distractions.

Re: How Technology Hijacks People’s Minds

#287

Post by B1FF_PSUVM » Fri, May 20, 2016, 9:42 PM UTC

DigitalJack wrote: post #216

lars wrote: post #30

Wow, I'm glad this was posted. I think the way we use technology today will be looked back on the same way we look back at naive cigarette smoking in the 1950s. Modern app design isn't about creating things that are good for the user, but about creating want in the user. This is a problem. For example, there are several studies showing that using Facebook in general makes people less happy. User happiness just happen…

You couldn't be more right. Looking at apps on Apple's App Store, you will often see them bragging about their app being "Addictive," or in reviews, people will state how addictive the app is as if that were a good thing.

That and "aggressive" for praising car designs. Great idea, we really could use some more aggression on the roads ...

Re: How Technology Hijacks People’s Minds

#288

Post by TaylorGood » Fri, May 20, 2016, 9:44 PM UTC

stinkytaco wrote: post #136

supergreg wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So no hobbies?

I think the key phrase in his post is "intuitively bad". If you enjoy programming, gardening, running, watching a bit of tv or whatever then good for you. But I think all of us have reached point with one thing or another (from too much computer Solitaire to overeating) where we realize it's not really making us much happier.

For me, the key is being honest as to when any hobbies or time / attention commitments become distractions i.e. detours. While it is possible a detour can become the shortcut, the likelihood of a "lightbulb moment" happen by refreshing X social media feed is less fertile than dedicated focus on Y.. be it a problem, project, etc.

Re: How Technology Hijacks People’s Minds

#289

Post by unclebucknasty » Fri, May 20, 2016, 9:45 PM UTC

rm_-rf_slash wrote: post #233

unclebucknasty wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a very strange form of argument. First, you are arguing that fracking doesn't cause these things, then you go on to list the specific constituents of fracking activity that cause them. Then, you're saying that fracking doesn't have to cause these problems, but the fact is that it has. So, it's the fracking industry itself that has given fracking a bad name. In general, it sounds like industry PR and misdirecti…

Did you know that driving a car will result in your hurtling through the windshield at 70mph and wrapping your spine around a tree... ... if you drive very fast and don't wear a seatbelt? As I have said exhaustively (because I am getting quite tired of repeating myself), the process of fracking - which has been done hundreds of times to no ill effect - is not inherently dangerous or error-prone. No more so than deep-…

>driving a car will result in your hurtling through the windshield

Specious.

>I am getting quite tired of repeating myself

You're missing my point. You're claiming that fracking can be done safely, but I'm not arguing that in the way that you think. What I'm saying is that there are frequently externalities brought about by the manner in which the fracking industry actually operates vs how you claim they could operate. Doubtless it's cheaper for them. Maybe the problem is that fracking can be done safely, but it's just not cost-desirable or even profitable to do so. I don't know. But you can't go jumping on people's heads for acknowledging the obvious: fracking can be dangerous.

>fracking is not inherently dangerous or error-prone.

What do you mean by "inherently"? If stringent regulations are required to constrain frackers from causing massive amounts of damage, then it seems to me that it is inherently dangerous by definition. This is where you seem to be mixing things up, as with your nuclear example. None of these things are "inherently safe". They are inherently dangerous if not conducted in a carefully prescribed manner, which is why the stringent regulation you advocate is required. So, you're really saying two different things here and trying to figure out why you're not getting your point across.

Anyway, therein lies the danger that people fear: even with the required regulation, mistakes can have and have had dire consequences. It's not unreasonable for people to have concerns.

So, It just comes off as a little disingenuous to exclaim that everyone has it wrong on fracking when the current reality is that they don't.

Re: How Technology Hijacks People’s Minds

#290

Post by greggman » Fri, May 20, 2016, 9:46 PM UTC

I had a mildly negative reaction to this article which seems different from most people's reactions here

Yelp example: I get that yelp is limiting my options but what did I do before yelp? Pretty much I just went to the 4 or 5 places I already knew instead of seeing if there was something new nearby. I tried hundreds of new places because of recommendations from Google Maps or Yelp that I likely would not have tried otherwise. Certainly not before I had this thing in my pocket that let me research at the moment of desire instead of having the plan ahead

Similarly I look for meetups and have been to way more activities that I would have gone to in the past.

On the slot machine idea: Before smartphones and apps I'd flip through a magazines and hope there'd be something interesting. Before digital TV back when channel surfing tuned into each channel immediately instead of taking 3-5 seconds I'd flip through channels hoping to discover an interesting program. When I buy a book I'm gambling it's going to catch me. When I go to a new restaurant I'm gambling it's going to be delicious (it often isn't)

I guess I don't really see the difference between that and many of the things listed on that list.

I also do uninstall apps. I've un-followed 90% of my connections to keep it my feed actually relevant to me.

Sure I do spend too much time on (in my own opinion) on the net for various things. hopefully I can keep it under control.

It got more scary for me toward the end where he seemed to be calling for government regulation. A digital "bill of rights". An FDA for Tech. No doubt he's assuming he'll be on the committees to decide what's best for everyone else.