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Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?

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Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?

#611

Post by hrmageddon »

HR manager here who has dealt with this exact situation a number of times. Retaining counsel for consult is a good idea but do not be surprised if they tell you that unless it's specifically in your policy that this is prohibited, nothing here is likely actionable.

In fact the "ideal" scenario is that two employees interact, one rejects/rebuffs/corrects the other for harassing or inappropriate remarks and it does not continue. IF it continues you have something to work with, at present it does not sound like you do. Thank your employee for telling you and for speaking up, and ask her to keep you updated.

Sexual harassment, like other workplace harassment issues, generally has to be considered "pervasive and severe" to be something with teeth, and yes the court has generally very high standards for what constitutes both of those things.

Talk to your HR rep and do not burn up a ton of cash on lawyers just yet. Talk to them about this as a constellation of fit issues for the role, see if term is needed for all of the above. Make plans to hold a sexual harassment and bullying training anyway for all EEs. Let HR help you with this, seriously, we deal with it all the time.

Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?

#612

Post by Mz »

sridca wrote: post #525
Mz wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, he did not apologize. Nor did I expect him too. I expected him to treat me with respect, not kiss my ass, curry favor or fear me. I spent some time making sure he understood that I was not a threat to him, not out to get him and that I was also going to do all in my power to respect him. This is how I won his trust. He was a very good looking man in a female majority department. Eventually, he seemed to take a fe…

> [letting women] verbally feel him up Could you explain what you mean by this phrase?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11687362

Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?

#613

Post by Mz »

zerr wrote: post #528
Mz wrote: post #174

So, I am female. When working at a Fortune 500 company, I once emailed a colleague and copied our two bosses. I advised him to never speak that way to me again. It went to HR. I got interviewed. I assume he got interviewed. He was not fired. He never spoke that way to me again. I eventually reestablished trust with this man and we got on well. I suspect he got sensitivity training. I was not told what went down. It w…

Interesting, did you first explain your complaints to that colleague (without CC-ing others) and got no result?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11687362

Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?

#615

Post by zerr »

Mz wrote: post #613
zerr wrote: post #528

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting, did you first explain your complaints to that colleague (without CC-ing others) and got no result?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11687362

Not a native English speaker and maybe I'm missing something between lines - I don't understand your story.

So your "I advised him to never speak that way to me again" was about "gushing"? I had too look up the word, but couldn't find offensive example atm. And as I understood you've never asked him to not to "gush" you (whatever that means) before CC-ing others, right?

Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?

#616

Post by Mz »

zerr wrote: post #615
Mz wrote: post #613

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11687362

Not a native English speaker and maybe I'm missing something between lines - I don't understand your story. So your "I advised him to never speak that way to me again" was about "gushing"? I had too look up the word, but couldn't find offensive example atm. And as I understood you've never asked him to not to "gush" you (whatever that means) before CC-ing others, right?

No, sorry. I never asked him to not gush at me, nor did I find that offensive. Nor did i need to ask that. The detail that you are missing is that he turned something I said into sexual innuendo, something he had never done before. In other words, he took a non sexual comment by me and replied to it in a sexually suggestive manner. This was not something he had ever done before and I was very clear it was malicious behavior. He did not like the fact that I was replying to him in a more low key manner and he was upping the stakes.

Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?

#617

Post by zerr »

Mz wrote: post #616
zerr wrote: post #615

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not a native English speaker and maybe I'm missing something between lines - I don't understand your story. So your "I advised him to never speak that way to me again" was about "gushing"? I had too look up the word, but couldn't find offensive example atm. And as I understood you've never asked him to not to "gush" you (whatever that means) before CC-ing others, right?

No, sorry. I never asked him to not gush at me, nor did I find that offensive. Nor did i need to ask that. The detail that you are missing is that he turned something I said into sexual innuendo, something he had never done before. In other words, he took a non sexual comment by me and replied to it in a sexually suggestive manner. This was not something he had ever done before and I was very clear it was malicious b…

Oh, got it, now it completely makes sense to me, thanks. Just minor note regarding the prose - that innuendo is mentioned once in the middle, and kind of "by the way" I think, while you mention a lot of "gushing" before and after that, and it grabs the attention, so I thought that must be something bad.. :) but probably because of my "non-native-speakerness".

Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?

#618

Post by Mz »

zerr wrote: post #617
Mz wrote: post #616

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, sorry. I never asked him to not gush at me, nor did I find that offensive. Nor did i need to ask that. The detail that you are missing is that he turned something I said into sexual innuendo, something he had never done before. In other words, he took a non sexual comment by me and replied to it in a sexually suggestive manner. This was not something he had ever done before and I was very clear it was malicious b…

Oh, got it, now it completely makes sense to me, thanks. Just minor note regarding the prose - that innuendo is mentioned once in the middle, and kind of "by the way" I think, while you mention a lot of "gushing" before and after that, and it grabs the attention, so I thought that must be something bad.. :) but probably because of my "non-native-speakerness".

Yeah, with answering your question, I realized I could stand to make that clearer. I hope to get to that today. So I appreciate you asking. Thanks.

Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?

#619

Post by owenmarshall »

joantune wrote: post #544
vacri wrote: post #437

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, HN. The place where people complain that companies aren't willing to invest in their employees by (re)training them, and the place where firing is demanded if people make a misstep. Embezzlement is not equatable here - embezzlement is an objective crime that attracts jail time. Flirting with someone in the office (even if clumsy) is not - there's plenty of office romances out there, and people don't go to jail fo…

OP: if you want to build a team, scalping people for any misstep won't be a good idea, especially if you have no clear policy regarding what is proper or not.

hahaha holy shit, this person thinks "calling your coworker a milf" is 'any (silly ol') misstep' and literally thinks a written HR policy is needed before you discipline them for clear sexual harassment

HR COMMANDMENT XVI: thou shalt not call your coworker a milf

HR COMMANDMENT XVII: thou shalt not ask your coworker to suck your d

HR COMMANDMENT XVIII: thou shalt not tell others in the office "your coworker has DSLs"

Re: Ask HN: How do I deal with the first sexual harassment complaint at my startup?

#620

Post by joantune »

illumin8 wrote: post #551
joantune wrote: post #541

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and you know why that is? nothing on the OPs post reveals a clear infringement or harassment IMO. MILF is borderline a bad way to talk to someone, yet, everyone here is saying: FIRE HIM or FIRE THEM. It would be harassment if he continued after she said stop, it would be harassment if he groped her, it would be harassment if he talked clearly obscenely about her, MILF is borderline, and yet, everyone is saying, FIRE…

Asking someone on a date that isn't interested in you is harassment. Calling someone a MILF is definitely harassment. Do you seriously think telling someone in a professional setting that they're a mother you'd like to f--- is not harassment? When asking someone on a date that isn't interested in you is? Read your HR policies - if you don't, I suspect you'll be in trouble like this someday, based on your attitude tow…

> Asking someone on a date that isn't interested in you is harassment.

How would you know if you don't ask?

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