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Zenefits Was the Perfect Startup, Then It Self-Disrupted

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Re: Zenefits Was the Perfect Startup, Then It Self-Disrupted

#121
post #3

So a company that blatantly cheated will pay some fines and still be worth billions. The founders and early employees will all be rich, or richer than they were when they started. The investors will get a very healthy return. The lesson: break the rules and grow so fast that by the time regulators catch up, you can put on a show of reforming and still keep most of the value that you created. Admirable disruption or h…

In the mean time, who was harmed?

Re: Zenefits Was the Perfect Startup, Then It Self-Disrupted

#122
post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's really good. I'd normally just up-vote and move on, but I've gotta ask: Is that original or did that come from somewhere? If the latter -- I'd appreciate a reference because I'd like to read more.

I was thinking of the C.S. Lewis quote from The Abolition of Man: "The head rules the belly through the chest."

Thank you. Makes sense. I'm more of a G.K. Chesterton man myself, but maybe I'll come around! :-)

Re: Zenefits Was the Perfect Startup, Then It Self-Disrupted

#123

Does Conrad's resignation mean forfeiting his own equity?

Probably not: He owns whatever portion is vested, subject to dilution in event of future fundraising. Some of his equity will already be vested based on his tenure and vesting schedule used. Plus, if his agreement has any kind of vesting acceleration clause that ignites upon material event (company sale, key personnel replacement including his position, etc), he may well be fully vested.

Re: Zenefits Was the Perfect Startup, Then It Self-Disrupted

#124
post #121
post #3

So a company that blatantly cheated will pay some fines and still be worth billions. The founders and early employees will all be rich, or richer than they were when they started. The investors will get a very healthy return. The lesson: break the rules and grow so fast that by the time regulators catch up, you can put on a show of reforming and still keep most of the value that you created. Admirable disruption or h…

In the mean time, who was harmed?

The reason you require licensing for insurance sales is because it's very difficult to track all of the individual instances of malfeasance. So, the answer to your question is, "I don't know."

But just because I don't have particular instances of harm, doesn't mean this isn't an problem. If you let anybody sell health insurance, you end up with con artists selling sham insurance, and by the time you track down the conman, real people are hurt. Sure you can fine the shysters, or maybe even put them in jail (but probably not), but in the meantime, families savings are wiped out to pay the medical bills, or worse, people get sick and die because they can't get treatment.

Re: Zenefits Was the Perfect Startup, Then It Self-Disrupted

#125
post #3

So a company that blatantly cheated will pay some fines and still be worth billions. The founders and early employees will all be rich, or richer than they were when they started. The investors will get a very healthy return. The lesson: break the rules and grow so fast that by the time regulators catch up, you can put on a show of reforming and still keep most of the value that you created. Admirable disruption or h…

isnt this the same battleplan youtube, buzzfeed, and imgur used to get big? blatantly lift copywritten material, displace other content aggregates, and by the time you have enough traction and money you can fund some original content or pay the appropriate licenses. (albeit imgur isnt to step 3 yet, still stuck on profit.)

Re: Zenefits Was the Perfect Startup, Then It Self-Disrupted

#126
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's wrong with putting companies out of business? I understand that it ends up having impacts on people that aren't necessarily involved in the misbehavior, but it provides officers and investors a significant incentive to avoid wrongdoing.

> I understand that it ends up having impacts on people that aren't necessarily involved in the misbehavior, but ... The fact that you understand this could bankrupt and destroy people's lives simply because they worked at the wrong company at the wrong time, but still seek to rationalize it, is more than a little disturbing. Having draconian penalties for line employees is not going to do anything to dissuade a C-le…

We destroy people's lives for lots of reasons in the US. Protecting the public from poorly behaved businesses would be better than most of them.

Re: Zenefits Was the Perfect Startup, Then It Self-Disrupted

#128
post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the mean time, who was harmed?

The reason you require licensing for insurance sales is because it's very difficult to track all of the individual instances of malfeasance. So, the answer to your question is, "I don't know." But just because I don't have particular instances of harm, doesn't mean this isn't an problem. If you let anybody sell health insurance, you end up with con artists selling sham insurance, and by the time you track down the co…

Is Zenefits a con artist wiping out people's savings?

Re: Zenefits Was the Perfect Startup, Then It Self-Disrupted

#129
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's wrong with putting companies out of business? I understand that it ends up having impacts on people that aren't necessarily involved in the misbehavior, but it provides officers and investors a significant incentive to avoid wrongdoing.

> I understand that it ends up having impacts on people that aren't necessarily involved in the misbehavior, but ... The fact that you understand this could bankrupt and destroy people's lives simply because they worked at the wrong company at the wrong time, but still seek to rationalize it, is more than a little disturbing. Having draconian penalties for line employees is not going to do anything to dissuade a C-le…

How does getting laid off from a startup destroy someones life? I can understand someone getting annoyed at not getting rich or not getting ROI from lower pay. But, that's from being both an employee an an investor.
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