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Lyft and Uber to Halt Operations in Austin After Voters Reject Proposal

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Re: Lyft and Uber to Halt Operations in Austin After Voters Reject Proposal

#91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It does not do anything against a repeat sex offender who will randomly assault a customer every few months. This would never happen. The first time they assault a passenger, they'd immediately get kicked off the platform and likely referred to police. You can commit a crime as an Uber driver, but there's no way you're getting away with it. There's a precise log of who you drove and where.

that does not help the first victim.

Background checks, by definition, also do not help the first victim.

Re: Lyft and Uber to Halt Operations in Austin After Voters Reject Proposal

#92
post #52
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting in a car with random strangers is a perfect case of information asymmetry. Passengers aren't going to be repeat customers with the same drivers. Each driver is pretty much an unknown that the passenger has little control over choosing. On the broader point about what the government should be regulating: One of the worst things about living outside the developed world is how careful you have to be. You have to…

I couldn't disagree more. Whether or not a passenger is a repeat customer of a driver is irrelevant, the drivers are rated by each passenger (at least for uber, this is non-optional), and if their rating gets too low, they stop getting fares. This system is infinitely more effective, efficient, fair and maybe most importantly, up to date, than any background check or fingerprinting system ever could be. And not only…

How does a rating stop a person from becoming a driver just so he can rape his first fare, then quit? He's not going to be bothered by stars or future fares.

Re: Lyft and Uber to Halt Operations in Austin After Voters Reject Proposal

#93
Don't forget who the biggest victims of background checks will be. Unemployable ex-cons. Anyone who's been convicted at any time in their life will have yet another door to employment shut in their face.

Maybe 10 or 20 years ago, New Zealand decided to ban anyone with a record of sexual offending from being a taxi driver. That sounds good and safe to the average Joe but one poor man, in his 50's I think, lost his job because he'd been convicted as a teenager of having sex with his then-underage girlfriend. They'd since been happily married and still were. Somehow that meant he was considered unsafe to drive people around in a taxi.

Background checks are a blunt and harsh tool to re-punish people for unrelated crimes.

Re: Lyft and Uber to Halt Operations in Austin After Voters Reject Proposal

#94
post #11

I am really confused at this article. Uber and Lyft don't want to operate in areas that require fingerprint based background checks. I get it. Harder to get drivers, more process, etc. But isn't that just a cost of doing business? On the surface this seems reasonable. Uber/Lyft are welcome to raise fares if the background checks result in less drivers on the road. Subsequently the consumer is welcome to not use Uber/…

This is just rent seeking by the govt. and taxi / limo industry. It's an artificial barrier to entry.

Re: Lyft and Uber to Halt Operations in Austin After Voters Reject Proposal

#95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm also confused because similar legislation has passed elsewhere (like here in Australia) and Uber 'welcomed' it (in the sense that Uber was not made illegal) and continues to operate with the added sensible legislation.

In Germany you need a special drivers license to commercially transport people, which is mostly a background check and regular checkups that you're physically capable for driving people around. Uber used drivers that didn't have it until they were told to stop. It just shows again how Uber is trying to prey on competitors by ignoring all regulations.

Wait, in Germany you cannot drive your family around without a special driving licence? Not all regulation makes sense...

Re: Lyft and Uber to Halt Operations in Austin After Voters Reject Proposal

#96
post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Germany you need a special drivers license to commercially transport people, which is mostly a background check and regular checkups that you're physically capable for driving people around. Uber used drivers that didn't have it until they were told to stop. It just shows again how Uber is trying to prey on competitors by ignoring all regulations.

Wait, in Germany you cannot drive your family around without a special driving licence? Not all regulation makes sense...

"Commercially transport people" he said. Do you normally charge a fee when you transport your family? If so the. You are a taxi service and fall under the regulations.

Re: Lyft and Uber to Halt Operations in Austin After Voters Reject Proposal

#97
post #92
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I couldn't disagree more. Whether or not a passenger is a repeat customer of a driver is irrelevant, the drivers are rated by each passenger (at least for uber, this is non-optional), and if their rating gets too low, they stop getting fares. This system is infinitely more effective, efficient, fair and maybe most importantly, up to date, than any background check or fingerprinting system ever could be. And not only…

How does a rating stop a person from becoming a driver just so he can rape his first fare, then quit? He's not going to be bothered by stars or future fares.

How does a background check or fingerprint accomplish that either? And secondly, why is that even a concern? If someone wants to rape, they don't need to be an uber driver to do it.

Re: Lyft and Uber to Halt Operations in Austin After Voters Reject Proposal

#98
post #92
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I couldn't disagree more. Whether or not a passenger is a repeat customer of a driver is irrelevant, the drivers are rated by each passenger (at least for uber, this is non-optional), and if their rating gets too low, they stop getting fares. This system is infinitely more effective, efficient, fair and maybe most importantly, up to date, than any background check or fingerprinting system ever could be. And not only…

How does a rating stop a person from becoming a driver just so he can rape his first fare, then quit? He's not going to be bothered by stars or future fares.

How does a fingerprint/background check stop a person from becoming a driver just so he can rape his first fare, then quit?

You're basically asking, how does X prevent a person from being a rapist?

Answer: nothing can "prevent" rapists and murderers. they exist regardless of precautions, and the word "prevention" is overused. background checks, and fingerprints do nothing to prevent creeps.

Re: Lyft and Uber to Halt Operations in Austin After Voters Reject Proposal

#99
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually feel fingerprints are a bad idea but I also feel the city has a right to enact ordinances that the populace believes will help keep them "safer". One other thought is that why wouldn't Uber/Lyft want these regulations. It seems like the are already the dominant party and fingerprint regulation would create a moat for other competitors to enter.

> I also feel the city has a right to enact ordinances that the populace believes will help keep them "safer". But there's a limit somewhere, right? You don't feel that a city has the right to enact an ordinance keeping black people out even if it made them feel safer (I assume), so there has to be some line around a city's democratic rights?

There's actually not. Unless it infringes on a protected class (eg "no black people") or a fundamental liberty interest, the "rational basis" standard prevails. This basically means that if a hypothetical reason could be articulated to support a public interest it's legal, even if it does not actually achieve that goal in practice.

This becomes particularly broad when you're talking about actions in public. So while it would probably be considered an intrusion to send the Dental Police into everyone's home to be sure that they floss daily, it would probably be legal to have the Dental Police perform mandatory tooth-brushings on all taxi drivers. Nobody is forcing you to be a taxi driver and you could reasonably avoid the situation by practicing another profession instead.

That's how you get stuff like requiring hair nets for food safety. But again, it doesn't necessarily have to be sensical. Unless otherwise restricted, states and cities have an enormous amount of leeway to do whatever they think is in their citizens' best interests. It's a list of things you can't do, not a list of things you can.

If Austin wants to fingerprint taxi drivers, that's well within their powers. Not even controversial - that has been common practice for probably a half century now.

Re: Lyft and Uber to Halt Operations in Austin After Voters Reject Proposal

#100
post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Germany you need a special drivers license to commercially transport people, which is mostly a background check and regular checkups that you're physically capable for driving people around. Uber used drivers that didn't have it until they were told to stop. It just shows again how Uber is trying to prey on competitors by ignoring all regulations.

Wait, in Germany you cannot drive your family around without a special driving licence? Not all regulation makes sense...

The law isn't like programming. Judges typically see a difference between driving your family around driving for cash on Uber
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