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Putting the Tesla HEPA Filter and Bioweapon Defense Mode to the Test

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Re: Putting the Tesla HEPA Filter and Bioweapon Defense Mode to the Test

#141

Post by PhasmaFelis »

StanislavPetrov wrote: post #137
venomsnake wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think he meant the intent of the creator of the compound/item. A gun is created to kill. A taser to incapacitate. A knife is created to cut/stab things - and since human flesh is highly cuttable substance even kitchen knives are considered weapons. A car is created to transport people but can be used to kill. Cars are not weapons because in their conception there is no intent to harm someone.

What about a rock? The same analogy holds true. Anything can be a weapon, its simply absurd to contend that intent matters.

There has to be intent in there someone. A gun is a weapon. A rock can be a weapon. A dangerous polluting factory may be criminally negligent and morally despicable, but it's not a weapon unless it was deliberately deployed to maximize exposure to a target group. (Which isn't out of the question, given human nature, but I haven't heard of any evidence for it happening yet.)

Re: Putting the Tesla HEPA Filter and Bioweapon Defense Mode to the Test

#142

Post by hinkley »

JshWright wrote: post #120
kragen wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Before the hazmat teams arrive! What, are you going to wait around in the danger zone and keep breathing spores? I'll adopt your kids if they're good at scrubbing floors and cooking.

It's not the arrival of the HazMat team that makes the car unsafe to exit... It is the contamination present on the outside of the car. You are bringing the 'danger zone' with you (and exposing countless other people who would not have otherwise been exposed as you drive around)

You aren't IN the danger zone. You ARE the danger zone!

Re: Putting the Tesla HEPA Filter and Bioweapon Defense Mode to the Test

#143

Post by saulrh »

aerovistae wrote: post #138
saulrh wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have a sensor that can detect things the size of bioweapon pathogens at concentrations where airborne pathogens would be dangerous, then yes, you absolutely can test for them. And, what do you know, some common bioweapon bacteria are around .5 um, and HEPA filters have to be able to filter out 99+% of objects .3 um to be rated as HEPA bu the US DOE. Add on that many bioweapons are actually not natively airborn…

God, I hope they don't apply the same rationale to TSA. "Well, there's clearly no real way to get anything dangerous through here without the metal detectors picking it up, so no need to test our systems with any realistic threats."

The TSA would be completely, perfectly effective if it simply didn't let anybody get on planes. That defeats the purpose of the TSA, of course; they have to let people on planes. Our filter, by comparison, is allowed to stop everything, which makes its job much easier.

* Aerosols are really the only effective way to deliver biological weapons. This holds even with person-to-person transmission; "airborne" transmission almost always means "infected person coughs, spreading aerosolized fluids that contain infectious bodies".

* Aerosol droplets smaller than .5 um don't land on parts of the lungs that can absorb them and are re-exhaled relatively harmlessly. Aerosol droplets smaller than .5 um also lose stability (evaporate, chemical changes, solar irradiation) too quickly to be useful.

"Realistic Threats" are, in this case, particles between .5 um and 5 um. There is zero difference between a droplet with and without an infectious payload. If you really wanted to you could do this test with some completely harmless organism like a household micrococcus strain, but it wouldn't demonstrate anything new. If there are no particles of that size coming through the filter, you are safe, in the same way that the plane would be safe if it took off with no people in it.

Re: Putting the Tesla HEPA Filter and Bioweapon Defense Mode to the Test

#144

Post by superuser2 »

gambiting wrote: post #93
venomsnake wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a subtle but - military cannot use bioweapons due to Geneva. Only in Syria they can, but the market for Teslas there is limited. You cannot charge it, there are barely any roads left to drive it on and you will be dealing with a lot of legal to use military stuff raining on your head that Tesla has no protection from. So that is a statement that cannot be put to the test.

I'll be incredibly pedantic here - isn't it the same as saying that a car can technically go 180mph? The only place on earth where you can drive that fast legally is the German Autobahn, so for 99% of buyers it's absolutely irrelevant. So is defense against bioweapons - what this tells me, is that the car has REALLY good air filtration system, just like the fact that the max speed is 180mph tells me the car is likely…

>The only place on earth where you can drive that fast legally is the German Autobahn

Incorrect. Racing your high-performance but street legal cars on tracks is a popular pastime among those who can afford it.

Re: Putting the Tesla HEPA Filter and Bioweapon Defense Mode to the Test

#145

Post by gambiting »

superuser2 wrote: post #144
gambiting wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll be incredibly pedantic here - isn't it the same as saying that a car can technically go 180mph? The only place on earth where you can drive that fast legally is the German Autobahn, so for 99% of buyers it's absolutely irrelevant. So is defense against bioweapons - what this tells me, is that the car has REALLY good air filtration system, just like the fact that the max speed is 180mph tells me the car is likely…

>The only place on earth where you can drive that fast legally is the German Autobahn Incorrect. Racing your high-performance but street legal cars on tracks is a popular pastime among those who can afford it.

By that logic, you can test your tesla's bioweapon defense system by putting it inside a controlled environment where the system will be put to the test - just like the car is tested to its limits in a controlled environment - ie racing track. Doesn't change the fact that we are still taking less than 1% of the customers here.

Re: Putting the Tesla HEPA Filter and Bioweapon Defense Mode to the Test

#146

Post by JshWright »

hinkley wrote: post #142
JshWright wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not the arrival of the HazMat team that makes the car unsafe to exit... It is the contamination present on the outside of the car. You are bringing the 'danger zone' with you (and exposing countless other people who would not have otherwise been exposed as you drive around)

You aren't IN the danger zone. You ARE the danger zone!

I prefer to be on the highway [away from] the danger zone!

Re: Putting the Tesla HEPA Filter and Bioweapon Defense Mode to the Test

#147

Post by Vik1ng »

viraptor wrote: post #140
squeaky-clean wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn't seem like just marketing for the Audi. It seems like the car is seriously intended for individuals who may be attacked, politicians, very rich/powerful people in unsafe areas. It's not for your grandparents to drive to church on Sundays. It looks like most people buying it are politicians and diplomats. The security features are also an upgrade that costs like $600k. It has a built in "patented emergency…

It's class BR7 protection. That means it protects from lead bullets. That's all. Here's a list of examples of what it doesn't protect from: AK47 with hardened or armor-piercing bullets, incendiary bullets, tank fired shells.

I wouldn't be surprised if the author confused gas tank and tank.

> Oh, and for even more money on top of all that, special battery and tank protection can be fitted.

Re: Putting the Tesla HEPA Filter and Bioweapon Defense Mode to the Test

#148

Post by aerovistae »

saulrh wrote: post #143
aerovistae wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

God, I hope they don't apply the same rationale to TSA. "Well, there's clearly no real way to get anything dangerous through here without the metal detectors picking it up, so no need to test our systems with any realistic threats."

The TSA would be completely, perfectly effective if it simply didn't let anybody get on planes. That defeats the purpose of the TSA, of course; they have to let people on planes. Our filter, by comparison, is allowed to stop everything , which makes its job much easier. * Aerosols are really the only effective way to deliver biological weapons. This holds even with person-to-person transmission; "airborne" transmissi…

"Our filter"? Are you a Tesla Motors employee? If so, question, how about changing the filter after a biological attack? How is that done?

Re: Putting the Tesla HEPA Filter and Bioweapon Defense Mode to the Test

#149

Post by saulrh »

aerovistae wrote: post #148
saulrh wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The TSA would be completely, perfectly effective if it simply didn't let anybody get on planes. That defeats the purpose of the TSA, of course; they have to let people on planes. Our filter, by comparison, is allowed to stop everything , which makes its job much easier. * Aerosols are really the only effective way to deliver biological weapons. This holds even with person-to-person transmission; "airborne" transmissi…

"Our filter"? Are you a Tesla Motors employee? If so, question, how about changing the filter after a biological attack? How is that done?

Sorry, started thinking like I was writing a paper. Not a Tesla Motors employee. Used "our filter" to separate it from "the TSA's filter".

For the actual question: you probably leave the filter in place until it's clogged, at which point you replace it as normal except you're wearing a hazard suit. Those filters basically don't let anything go. However, note that the filter will be exactly as contaminated as anything else on the outside of the car is; a persistent weapon will have covered every surface in the attacked area with hazardous numbers of spores or similar, not just the filters. If it's not a persistent weapon - that is, it's designed to kill or incap everybody and then dissipate so your soldiers can walk in two days later and take over - then you just wait those two days.

Re: Putting the Tesla HEPA Filter and Bioweapon Defense Mode to the Test

#150

Post by gcb0 »

tajen wrote: post #40
gcb0 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't wait for the model 3. it will have a bear attack prevention rock as standard equipment!

Indeed. I see people complaint that this is marketing. It exactly is. Just like Steve Jobs and his jewel-style boxes. Some people enjoy paying for a good show. The biodefense is straight out from a Tarantino style: When you exaggerate enough that you can't possibly be taken seriously, but the audience starts discussing whether that's credible or not. There is a strange expectation that you can't have a good laugh abo…

maybe, but you will be losing the Toyota radio that goes up to eleven.

in all seriousness, just buy any car and install the optional hepa filter. no American car install them by default, saving them some $0.50 in production costs. but you can then buy the filters for $10 and install yourself in under two hours. you can even add the active carbon polymer sheet to prevent outside smell.

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