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Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone

sciencemag.org

281–290 of 398 posts

Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone

#281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will comment on it from my point of view (theoretical CS PhD student): > What's wrong with giving other researchers the ability to rate and comment on a paper. I do not see nothing inherently bad with this (provided very good moderation tools are in place). However... * > I would argue it works just as well a this journal reputation system * As a journal reputation system, possibly; although I find that experts hav…

Why do reviewers work for free? And why scientists agree to give away their work for free?

I think it's because no one can agree on a price, tax and international payments is too expensive, and there's a tit-for-tat understanding.

First, the price. The last paper I reviewed took me about 10 hours. I charge $200/hour. Should I charge $2000 for my time? If I'm paid by the hour, who tells me when to stop? If I'm paid a flat fee, how much is that fee?

I have seen a reviewer write something like "I read the paper twice. It seems good. Publish it." Does that get the same as someone who spends 10 hours for a detailed critique?

Second, does payment constitute work-for-hire? Does the publisher and/or reviewer need to pay taxes? Might some reviewers have a contract which prevents them from taking on part-time work? What if the reviewer is overseas? Do tax agencies from two different countries need to be involved?

Third, most people expect to publish, and get their papers reviewed. If a single author has three reviewers, then that author should expect to do about three reviews. This is an imperfect system which rewards publishing rather than reviewers, but there are also some compensations to the reviewer.

Moreover, I recall one story - I don't know the validity of it, but it has a ring of truth - where a daycare got annoyed with parents who picked up the children late. They decided to fine parents should that happen. As a result, children were picked up late more often because the fine was interpreted as a fee for extra daycare, and no longer social chastisement.

I suspect that reviewers are in a similar boat. I'll feel different about it if I get paid a pittance than if I were to do it for free, so long as others do the same for me in the future.

Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone

#282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How do you keep a ratings system from being a proxy for popularity, rather than a measure of novelty or utility? How do you keep it from being easily gamed? To respond to this particular point, I'm not familiar with any characteristics of the academic journal system which prevent these problems either. Name recognition is often key to getting into competitive journals, which is just another way of calling it an eas…

Traditionally peer review is done anonymously from both sides. However, it is often possible to get a good idea of who the author is based on their related work, style and choice of references. This is particularly the case where the field is very specialised and there are only a few people qualified to judge papers.

This depends a lot on the field. Every neuro paper I have reviewed has the author's names and affiliations intact, along with unblinded citations like "Experiment was done as we described previously (SameFolks et al., 1999)."

On the other hand, I've always been suspicious that people can reliably guess the authors when doing a blinded review. I've seen one study that said 30% of reviewers (in a small sample) could do so, but that hardly seems like a reason to abandon the idea altogether.

Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone

#283
post #141
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Journals are used as a proxy for quality. A publication in "Science" or "Nature" is generally regarded as being better than a publication in, say, the "Proceedings of the National Academy of Science". Bibliographic metrics, like the number of publications and where they are published, are use as a proxy for the quality of someone's research. It can affect grant funding and career advancement. Researchers can publish…

Haven't we solved the quality issue in other situations by giving users the ability to rate a scientific paper. What's wrong with giving other researchers the ability to rate and comment on a paper. It's a not a perfect filter but I would argue it works just as well a this journal reputation system and it prevents issues like people having to publish with them to get recognized not to mention it encourages discussion…

It's hard to explain how important the journals are for a scientists. It's not even the effect that a paper in Nature is (in some disciplines) the fastest way to tenure. It's got an even bigger psychological factor: If you get into Science, you frame it and hang it on the most prominent wall in your living room or office. With a Nobel too rare to practically hope for, this system is the only reward all those mice-conditioning mice are conditioned to.

Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone

#284
post #49
post #18

Elsevier and others can go something themselves. Their behavior over the last two decades has been little more than reprehensible rent-seeking. Whatever goodwill they had disappeared as they sapped with increasing ruthlessness the dollars of students and non-profits. See, e.g., one of many such figures: http://www.lib.washington.edu/scholpub/images/economics_grap... It is absurd and dishonest to call Sci-Hub "piracy"…

Totally agree. I have gone through academia and am now in industry; the other day I wanted to read and browse basic papers in IEEE Explore for basic knowledge on new topics. Since I am no longer a student, I am willing to pay money - as much as hundreds to get unlimited access. Instead, for hundreds, IEEE explore offers a measly ("generous") 25 downloads a month or some such non-sense It just seemed so miserly of the…

The IEEE is such BS. I was a member but left because of all the SPAM. They continued to SPAM me for years after I left.

Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone

#286
post #18

Elsevier and others can go something themselves. Their behavior over the last two decades has been little more than reprehensible rent-seeking. Whatever goodwill they had disappeared as they sapped with increasing ruthlessness the dollars of students and non-profits. See, e.g., one of many such figures: http://www.lib.washington.edu/scholpub/images/economics_grap... It is absurd and dishonest to call Sci-Hub "piracy"…

I am with you, since pretty much any scientist would love to be cited by another's research, any scientist will send you a copy of their paper if you ask them for it. And since the creator of the work is willing to give it away to you for free, it cannot possibly be "piracy".

Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone

#288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eventually they'll just setup their own DNS system, or replace it with something else entirely. something like a BitTorrent for nameservers.

https://bit.namecoin.info/

NameCoin is a failure. There are two problems. 1. no one uses it. 2. cybersquatters.

Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone

#289

One of the reasons the deep learning field is moving so fast is that everything is open access. Generally, it's considered prestigious to present at a conference, and not much gets published in journals. The major conferences have been adopting a model of posting first on arxiv and then submitting to the conference, so the reviewers see the paper at the same time as the general public. The amazing thing is that weeks…

The quality of reviews of conference papers is mostly terrible, though. I've been on both sides of it, here are some major complaints:

* There is only one round of reviews, with a binary accept/reject outcome. In case of rejection, feedback cannot be incorporated. In case of acceptance, there is basically no incentive for incorporating feedback, as the paper is already "through" and putting in any more time is considered a waste.

* Assigning papers to reviewers is very arbitrary and often the reviewers are not at all familiar with the field. Getting a paper reassigned to another reviewer is often so complicated and time-consuming that reviewers just do the bare minimum (if asked to rate novelty/originality etc., on a scale 1-5 they give it a "3", which given the usual acceptance rate of * Reviewers usually get a lot of papers to review. They don't have time (who does?) but have to finish by a two-week deadline. If one of the papers is relevant to the research of the reviewer or has been written by colleagues they know (double-blind does not help, you recognize who wrote it..), that paper will receive attention; the other papers are seen as distraction and are dealt with as outlined above.

Peer-review is important, though. Some fields of research, particularly those where a lot of research is done by actual practitioners and not just pure research scientists, are mostly driven by conferences with short (one page or less) abstracts without full papers. There are often very few citeable sources that have been peer reviewed; conference websites and abstract books vanish over the years. An arxiv-like repository can help with that, but it does not solve the problem of peer review. Community-run open-access journals seem to provide a solution, but rarely take off.

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