They may have started servicing a need in the beginning as simply setting up some servers, and serving as a central repository, which I do not understand why this wasn't just setup by some other part like a university or research foundation for public use, but Elsevier have turned that into holding publicly-funded research hostage. You know when you are debating with somebody, and their logic runs out, they start floundering and emoting? That's what the comments from Elsevier are starting to sound like.
I have no problem with them making some money from Ads to help their monthly server hosting and maintenance costs, but they have a weird, self-strangulating business model that is headed nowhere real fast.
Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone
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Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone
#12Does this suggest that publishing companies like Reed Elsevier plc (RELX group) will eventually be starved of revenue from papers? Or have they figured out an alternative business model to adapt to the changing times?
Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone
#13> “I’m all for universal access, but not theft!” tweeted Elsevier’s director of universal access, Alicia Wise You want everybody to have access, but you don't want them to get it for free. Wow, so you want the entire world to all pay for the material you were given for free. Hmmmm.
That reminds me of the whole talk around "open standards" that you have to pay for to legally acquire (ANSI, ISO, IEEE, etc.), although in that case the situation is slightly different. Also, the "free software" vs "open source" distinction.
Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone
#14I'm sad Aaron Swartz did not live to see this unfolding. He might have been in prison now, but he would still be a world-class hero.
Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone
#15Elsevier believes they have United States law on their side. And they're right; they do have US law on their side. That just doesn't mean much anymore; it's been worn away by decades of conspicuous corruption, and lost most of its respect. In principle, this should be addressed by the US legislature. In practice, academia has effectively voted no-confidence and bypassed the legal system entirely.
Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone
#16I'm sad Aaron Swartz did not live to see this unfolding. He might have been in prison now, but he would still be a world-class hero.
I think about that a lot (have a number of friends publishing papers in academia). Really sad.
Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone
#17I recently wanted to read a five page paper on graph theory from 1977. The company entrusted with it 40 years ago is charging $38 for it. It is just absurd. I can't imagine that the author, now long dead, would have wanted his work to be so difficult to read.
Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone
#18Elsevier and others can go something themselves.
Their behavior over the last two decades has been little more than reprehensible rent-seeking. Whatever goodwill they had disappeared as they sapped with increasing ruthlessness the dollars of students and non-profits. See, e.g., one of many such figures: http://www.lib.washington.edu/scholpub/images/economics_grap...
It is absurd and dishonest to call Sci-Hub "piracy", given that all of its contents were originally created and given away with the express goal of wide dissemination.
Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone
#19> “I’m all for universal access, but not theft!” tweeted Elsevier’s director of universal access, Alicia Wise You want everybody to have access, but you don't want them to get it for free. Wow, so you want the entire world to all pay for the material you were given for free. Hmmmm.
The publishers are either given the material for free and readers have to pay, or the researchers pay the publishers on the order of $2k per page to have their research published as open access. Not great in either case.
Re: Who's downloading pirated papers? Everyone
#20What exactly is the benefit of Elsevier for researchers? Is there no free way to publish papers?