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Vim 8.0 is coming

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Re: Vim 8.0 is coming

#251

Post by adrianN »

ubertaco wrote: post #210
coldtea wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Mice are not a 100% replacement for keyboards. And they're not used as such. They are used as complimentary to keyboards. On the other hand, mice-based GUIs ARE a 100% replacement for CLIs.

>On the other hand, mice-based GUIs ARE a 100% replacement for CLIs. Really? I can automate a pipeline of GUIs? Please show me how I can automatically query a database, take that output, run complex data aggregation over those results combined with past results, send that to a remote server for storage, and email myself the result of the upload, using only a combination of GUIs. (Points deducted for anything that inv…

AppleScript can do pretty complex GUI automation tasks.

Re: Vim 8.0 is coming

#252

Post by codemonkeymike »

aorth wrote: post #228
codemonkeymike wrote: post #195

Been using Neovim for about 6 months now, The only real difference I have felt so far is that I was able to remove a few lines from my .vimrc, like history=10000 as Neovim does this by default. As for Vim, I am done with it forever, not because of vim more because of package managers compiling vim without paste mode or lua/ruby support and making me compile vim from source with my own flags, which was a harrowing exp…

Do you ever have to vim somewhere where there is no nvim? Like on a server, etc? I worry about getting used to nvim features or behaviors that might not be compatible with vim (are there any?) and being super bummed on a server some day!

Others have provided good answers but I'll add my 2 cents. Neovim was made to be fully(Mostly?) backwards compatible with all Vim specific features, and most Vi features. You may be wondering what is missing, some ed features and support for some more obscure Operating Systems. You shouldn't have to worry about the missing features as they are mostly legacy features that mostly all new/newish users of vim never will use. As for additional features they are mostly all under the hood, better embedablility, extensibility, and sensible defaults things you don't need when editing your Appache routes on the server.

Re: Vim 8.0 is coming

#253

Post by kps »

Spiritus wrote: post #92
jbmorgado wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From what this initial view of Vim 8.0 looks, it actually went in the direction of Neovim, the asynchronous inner works were what made me try Neovim in the 1st place. Now, from what I can understand, Neovim only has two advantages, a cleaner code trough re-writing (it's debatable if that's really an advantage) and the ability of using other languages for plugins (which seems clearly and advantage due to the lacking f…

Don't forget true color support for those sweet colorschemes!

Yeah, it would be nice if vim supported that natively, but it's possible to work around. My color scheme has lines of the form

    call High#Light("Comment", "italic", "bg", "#003300")
with a quick and dirty function that maps to the current terminal's supported colours. http://pastebin.com/3jx1i75L

Re: Vim 8.0 is coming

#254

Post by dkns »

pyre wrote: post #191
mbrock wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Emacs is free software developed by a worldwide community. It's a culture, an ecosystem, a way of life. The same with Vim, but I'm into Emacs. I love Lisp deeply, and I think Emacs is a truly amazing piece of technology. I had to use Xcode for a project and it gave me real anxiety. Weird things would go wrong and I had no idea how to fix them. The only sources of information were these horrible unanswered support thr…

> Weird things would go wrong and I had no idea how to fix them. My experience with Emacs/Spacemacs without having significant knowledge of lisp/elisp/Emacs debugging. I want to like Emacs, but my Vim environment feels so much more "solid".

Same here. I have emacs init.el file that I'd like to tinker with from time to time but every time I try to make switch I feel like I'm using a system consisting of thousands of moving parts which constantly break.

It's completely awesome that you can change anything in emacs however you want but time and time again I realize that I'd rather have a rock solid editor with small api that let's you customize few things.

Re: Vim 8.0 is coming

#255

Post by ZenoArrow »

ska wrote: post #238
ZenoArrow wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "There are many thing you can do, but it really, really isn't just like emacs." "a built-in package manager, just like in Emacs." They both have built-in package managers for extensions. I don't think this is a controversial statement.

That is fair - I mis-read "just like emacs" in your original. Apologies. The extension mechanism really isn't like emacs at all. Package management is a bit more similar (although can you easily add new repositories for nuget?)

> "although can you easily add new repositories for nuget?"

Yes. Here's a guide showing how to create a local Nuget repository:

http://codurance.com/2015/05/04/creating-a-local-nuget-repos...

In the guide you can see this screenshot:

http://codurance.com/assets/img/custom/blog/2015-05-01-creat...

Which shows you one way to set up the package source.

Also worth mentioning Paket, which is a Nuget replacement. In addition to working with the standard Nuget library, Paket can pull dependencies directly from Git repos.

https://fsprojects.github.io/Paket/

Re: Vim 8.0 is coming

#256

Post by super_mario »

toyg wrote: post #231
super_mario wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funny enough, iTerm2 has expose for its tabs, but I never use it. It's just not how I work. Drop shadows are not needed, since in iTerm2 or tmux the entire active windows is brighter and all others become slightly greyed out, so you never confuse what has focus. Bushed metal on the other hand is not something I want or desire.

> It's just not how I work. ... which means nobody else needs it, right? :)

I never implied that everyone should use the command line or that GUIs are evil or bad. I was just answering the query "why people still use command lines" to the original post.

Re: Vim 8.0 is coming

#258

Post by tetraodonpuffer »

sillysaurus3 wrote: post #35
krylon wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First of all, the key point of emacs is extensibility and customizability. So as new stuff comes up, e.g. new programming languages, debuggers, file formats, emacs can be extended without too much pain to work with them (and often, somebody has already done that for me). Secondly, working mainly as a sysadmin and only sometimes doing some development, I do far more with emacs than coding. I edit configuration files,…

I'm about to dive into org mode for the first time today. Do you have any tips for learning it? My plan was to open up the manual and start reading, but maybe you found an article or tutorial that helped kickstart your org mode knowledge, so I thought I'd ask. (Apologies if the question is a bit offtopic.)

there is a ton of stuff here

http://doc.norang.ca/org-mode.html

for me the initial "aha" moment was when I realized I could do an agenda window with multiple customizable horizontal blocks, so at a glance I can see deadlines, projects I am working on and so on

Adding to this something like being able to fulltext search across all my org files via org-occur-in-agenda-files is awesome too

Re: Vim 8.0 is coming

#259

Post by bobajeff »

cozzyd wrote: post #243
bobajeff wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I guess we could be saying the same in 10 years about firefox and chrome That's pretty optimistic considering Firefox's current marketshare. Based on its momentum I'd say in 10 years, at best, I expect it to be where Opera was before it became a Chromium fork. For now Firefox does things better than Chrome but I don't expect them to keep up when it becomes a community project. It'll be like using Opera used to be.

I imagine Firefox's marketshare dwarfs both vim and emacs

Yet another reason why you can't compare the situation with Firefox and Chrome to Vim and Emacs.

Re: Vim 8.0 is coming

#260

Post by Karunamon »

cname wrote: post #250
Karunamon wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who's "we"? If someone reaches a maximum of productivity using an editor made in the 70's, who is anyone else to tell them otherwise? Preferred tooling for reaching maximum productivity is an inherently personal thing - you may do your best in emacs, the other guy in vi, yet someone else in Sublime3 on Windows. Nobody is qualified to make broad sweeping judgments as to what works best for everyone. A few try, and som…

People usually claim that one thing is more productive than the other without any real evidence. I think it's mostly just so we can stick with something out of familiarity. Or sometimes it's so we can switch to something else because we're bored. The "it feels right to me" argument just seems unbeatable (you can't argue with it without seeming like a jerk). For example, I might say that I'm super productive in IDE X,…

But that's an unknown right? You may or may not be more productive in IDE Y, but making the effort to find that out takes more time, your most precious resource, for something that may not even turn out to be true, and then your investment is wasted.

I think this is why people tend to make the broad statements about "X is better than Y" since they only have their own experience to go on, but without full knowledge of how someone else's mind works, it's a fool's errand. Even if changing tools would solve the things you can observe and attach a "time wasted doing X" quantity, you don't know if they won't struggle with something else after changing.

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