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Blizzard shutting down Nostalrius, popular WoW private server

en.nostalrius.org

81–90 of 141 posts

Re: Blizzard shutting down Nostalrius, popular WoW private server

#81
post #68
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know that is an argument about expansions in the first place? Significant player dropoffs in WoW happen in the last patches before new expansions. The userbase usually spikes up on new releases, but almost always drops lower every time, predominately because new releases gate players who were on old versions against those on the new one. Friends stop being interested, unsub, and never come back because the player…

Blizzard isn't interested in "building a living world" and never has been. From its inception the purpose of WoW has been to farm the likes of you for gold.

And how do they continue to "farm" you for gold if you unsubscribe because you no longer feel a part of the world?

Re: Blizzard shutting down Nostalrius, popular WoW private server

#82
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know that is an argument about expansions in the first place? Significant player dropoffs in WoW happen in the last patches before new expansions. The userbase usually spikes up on new releases, but almost always drops lower every time, predominately because new releases gate players who were on old versions against those on the new one. Friends stop being interested, unsub, and never come back because the player…

This brings up another point in favor of "why not". If existing players who are willing to buy new expansions whenever they are available migrate to vanilla servers, they might as well opt out of buying the expansions, since adding new content in the vanilla servers will make them non-vanilla. Huh.

A prudent developer might make the expansions a mandatory purchase that adds the new content in cosmetic ways.

Re: Blizzard shutting down Nostalrius, popular WoW private server

#83
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The last good patch was Ulduar for me. ICC was big disappointment. Ulduar was the game at its peak. All downhill from there. I still hate how they crippled the hard modes afterwards.

Everyone has a patch they loved and was a peak for them. There are people who joined during cataclysm and think that was the best before "Panda" ruined the game. Plenty of people think BC was the peak and LK ruined everything. I personally think ICC was amazing and the peak, because that's when I played. MMO experiences are always the best when they are novel, there is something really special about the first time yo…

I still remember entering Horde territory on a PvP server for the first time trying to complete the baby Alliance warlock quests. It was a huge thrill, and I felt completely immersed. I had many other fun times in the game and seeing the other beautifully crafted zones, however, the time commitment I wanted to sink into the game to fully enjoy it couldn't be sustained. I had to quit for personal well being reasons.

Re: Blizzard shutting down Nostalrius, popular WoW private server

#84
post #74
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They could still outsource running old versions to a third party (with some sort of revenue share). They could have let these guys continue to run, sanction it but demand they charge X$ and pay y% of that to Blizzard. There are some pretty obvious downsides to that plan but it's an option.

It amounts to the same thing - 'they can do some deeply convoluted, labourious thing for a few thousand nostalgic players' or 'they can focus on meeting the needs and collecting the payments of their millions of existing customers'. It's hard to see how the former makes the slightest bit of sense for them.

I actually question how much interest there would be. Nostalrius reported 150k active players, with over 800k accounts. That is much higher than I would have thought.

Re: Blizzard shutting down Nostalrius, popular WoW private server

#86
post #61
post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't believe they actually re-create the backend. Seems harder than actually making a MMORPG from scratch. Where do you even begin?

You examine the packets received by the client in response to a discrete action by the client. Recorded enough of these, and you can emulate the server!

It would be pretty hilarious if this was a ML problem.

Re: Blizzard shutting down Nostalrius, popular WoW private server

#87
post #11
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One could argue that the Lich King was the last "good" patch for WoW. What I've never understood though was there is clearly some residual demand for "down rev" versions of the game where the mechanics favored a more engaged play style, why not facilitate it? How much does it really cost to run a single realm at the Vanilla, TBC, and LK levels? So many new players where their first experience with Onxyia was soloing…

My personal intuition is that splitting your userbase like this is disastrous for a game in the long-term (to say nothing of my intuition that 90% of people longing for "the old days" are just looking for a quick hit of nostalgia, with no intent to pay long-term). However, it's worth mentioning that Runescape now officially offers a "classic" version of the game alongside (and separate from) the modern version, which…

I really question this logic though. As someone who played with a large group of friends from Beta to TBC, none of us would even consider picking up WoW in its current state. Obviously this is a very small sample size, but I talked to many people when playing on Nost that felt the same way.

I do not see how they would be splitting the userbase, when many of the players of this server wouldn't even consider returning to Blizzard's current product.

Re: Blizzard shutting down Nostalrius, popular WoW private server

#88
post #4

I used to be involved with this sort of thing, and it's actually pretty interesting stuff. There are enormous open source projects, operating largely out of public sight, that have recreated the WoW server backend in most of its glory. The lower-level content works quite well these days, though a lot of complex raid scripts are missing or broken. This one is probably the most popular: https://github.com/TrinityCore/T…

I was involved in the Ultima Online scene.

I submitted RunUO patches to our local forks (I then had no idea how to help with "upstream" stuff), and I also was fan of Sphere based servers.

Also I GMed a couple servers, made maps, scripts, RPG Scenes, researched lore of the series to teach to people...

One thing that happened interestingly, is that several servers over time ended rolling back expansions, even if they already had implemented them, because of how obviously bad they were for the game overall, this also affected the mainstream EA servers, each expansion made people leave instead of grow...

The most popular servers were the "T2A" servers, that emulated the expansion "The Second Age", usually with a few minor features from new expansions (like custom house architecture).

I noticed after I started to study game design formally, that the problem of the expansions was two-fold: 1, power creep, lots of it, each expansion introduced stronger enemies, harder dungeons, and better equipment... and required that you paid for them to get all that, in a obvious cash grab, but that made the game unbalanced.

And 2, and biggest problem: it shifted the genre of the game!

When Ultima Online started, it was a sort of medieval life simulator, it had farming, alchemy, baking, and all sorts of "boring" daily stuff, there was even one interview were Richard Garriot mentioned when he was walking around invisible, and saw a warrior show up near a fisherman, and out of pity drop on the ground for him lots of good equipment, and the fisherman got offended, and explained he was a fisherman, he wanted to fish, not kill, and did not wanted swords and armour near him.

New expansions routinely broke "skills" that did non-combat tasks (example: item identification), or made them irrelevant (blacksmithing... in the original game a blacksmith could make the best equipment possible, after expansions blacksmithing became useless, with the best smithed equipment having only half the power of the stuff you could find in the "end-game" dungeons).

Meanwhile they introduced mostly combat features: new weapons, new offensive magic, new combat-based "classes" (in a game that was supposed to be classless in first place), and so on...

Also expansions gimped some past features that made the game interesting, for example in UO default map, you could attack anyone that you wanted, anywhere, the only protection players had were other players, and the city guards (that were practically invincible).

New expansions instead introduced new maps that had all sorts of shenanigans disabled, and lots of restrictions, also they made LOTS of maps, and after they pissed off players with the genre shifts, it became too much map for too little people, it became easy to wander for hours before ever meeting people.

Thus, if you wanted a "real" UO experience, private servers were the way to go.

Re: Blizzard shutting down Nostalrius, popular WoW private server

#89
post #60
post #4

I used to be involved with this sort of thing, and it's actually pretty interesting stuff. There are enormous open source projects, operating largely out of public sight, that have recreated the WoW server backend in most of its glory. The lower-level content works quite well these days, though a lot of complex raid scripts are missing or broken. This one is probably the most popular: https://github.com/TrinityCore/T…

I can't believe they actually re-create the backend. Seems harder than actually making a MMORPG from scratch. Where do you even begin?

The thing to understand is that MMORPGs create the illusion that they're kind of like browsers -- all the content is on the server, the client is little more than a window into a shared world.

That's not the case. The bandwidth would be crippling if it were. Most of the game is in the client. Clients know how to do actions, cast spells, count cooldowns, etc. The server has some maps that tell the clients "put this immobile resource here, spawn this mob there" (but the clients know what those resources and mobs look and act like, the server just tells them to instantiate a mob of this id there), and then sanity-checks and synchronizes the clients.

Re: Blizzard shutting down Nostalrius, popular WoW private server

#90

I learnt programming from running an ultimate online server back in the day. A little sad to seeing an(I assume), open source server like this being taken down. As an admin we use to run on the premise of, if we weren't told not to run it, we could. Probably not 100% legal but it seemed to work. It does make me wonder if they take the server down, is it because their subscription dropping so much?

Did you mean Ultima Online? Loved that game, were you running a sphere or RunUO server?
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