The authors family sought to raise their blue collar class to a higher one. I have for years thought of a non-profit that might do this by sponsoring children into music instrument lessons, horseback riding, and language lessons. Things that most (say 75% of people) cannot afford. This could be done in group lessons to save on cost.
Classism in America
191–200 of 341 posts
Re: Classism in America
#192Earlier quoted context omitted.
Since no-one else mentioned it yet in this subthread, the phenomenon you are discussing is called a sociolect: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sociolect Basically, since class is culture, and cultures have language, a sociolect describes the language of a class, the ways you have to talk to perform that class. And, naturally, this goes both ways. Someone talking the sociolect of a certain class is seen as performing th…
I could see the author choose more complicated vocabulary (superfluously) as she progressed through her introduction, and I took it as a demonstration of what she was talking about.
It may have been intentional or it may not have; I could hardly fault her for subconsciously "performing" given the context.
Re: Classism in America
#193Re: Classism in America
#194Earlier quoted context omitted.
Since no-one else mentioned it yet in this subthread, the phenomenon you are discussing is called a sociolect: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sociolect Basically, since class is culture, and cultures have language, a sociolect describes the language of a class, the ways you have to talk to perform that class. And, naturally, this goes both ways. Someone talking the sociolect of a certain class is seen as performing th…
Back in the middle ages, when the French conquered Britain, the ruling class spoke French and the peasants spoke English. A lot of French words flowed into English as a result. But even today, if people use the words of French origin rather than the old English words, one is regarded as being from the upper class, such as using 'purchase' instead of 'buy'. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_words_of_Frenc.…
> Back in the middle ages, when the French conquered Britain, the ruling class spoke French and the peasants spoke English.
This features quite a bit in War and Peace, too. As tensions increase between France and Russia as Napoleon takes over much of Europe and war between the countries looms, you'll find Russian nobility taking Russian language classes, because their first language is French!
Re: Classism in America
#195Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's remarkable to me how folks who would never, ever be seen to say anything rude about other races (or who would only do so very obliquely) will quite loudly smirk about how much they hate Southerners, how stupid they think Southerners are &c. It's all just class. One can be just as intelligent with a Southern accent as one can be stupid with another.
Exactly. As a southerner, I have an accent, but I also don't answer important questions fast. IOW, I pause a beat to collect my thoughts. People tend to think this too is a sign of "stupid". Really, it's just I don't like to be wrong. I'd rather be slow up front and be right, than fast up front and be wrong. However, our development culture tends to think everything needs to happen as fast as possible (the whole twit…
If it's any consolation, I wish I could pick up that behaviour. Might have saved me a fair bit of unpleasantness.
Re: Classism in America
#196Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Being from Europe, I was also weirded out that almost all discussions of class in the US was about money. The subtle differences between the USA and Europe on this subject are quite interesting. Another one is that in the USA, being branded as 'upper class' is pejorative and instantly implies you are rich, spoiled and not likely to be a hard worker, if you work at all.
> being branded as 'upper class' is pejorative That's also fascinating, because in the US, wanting to be rich is seen as a very positive thing. Everyone is supposed to be living the American Dream and improving their lives, but reaching the end goal is a bad state? Hilarious. And where I'm from, wanting to be rich is seen as an ugly thing, the only socially acceptable ways to be rich is to win the lottery or be a spo…
> That's also fascinating, because in the US, wanting to be rich is seen as a very positive thing. Everyone is supposed to be living the American Dream and improving their lives, but reaching the end goal is a bad state? Hilarious.
It's more complicated than that. It's people who start with wealth who are looked down on, not people who come from modest means to achieve wealth. The default assumption is that these individuals bought their way into whatever success they have, never have to work for anything, and never experience hardship.
Re: Classism in America
#197Because of where I grew up (rural South and Appalachia), my native accent is something that I've learned to mask in all professional settings. It doesn't matter how immaculate my grammar is: in the profession of software engineering, southern accent = ignorant bigot who can't be trusted. People's biases, conscious or otherwise, are noticeable. The irony is that I practice "code switching", so basically my coworkers h…
Seattle is wildly bigoted against Southerners. Wildly. It's a real problem.
This hasn't been my experience at all. I moved to Seattle from Alabama (almost 10 years ago now), and openly tell people I'm from Alabama, and I've yet to feel discriminated against because of it. In fact, some people are a bit envious of property prices there. I think mostly they are just glad I'm not from California ;).
Re: Classism in America
#198I once went out to lunch at a modest restaurant with a couple friends, one from a wealthy eastern family and one from poverty. The former was dressed like a slob, the latter in a nice suit. I was fascinated how the former exuded class in how he comfortably dealt with the waiter and the wine list, etc., while the latter clearly was desperately trying to do that and failing. The difference was apparent even in how they…
The Wire, which of course is an absolutely excellent longform meditation on class, has a couple really great scenes illustrating this exact thing:
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xhhJVYK4nvQ http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WmGemNT7urY
Re: Classism in America
#199Earlier quoted context omitted.
Really? I'm originally from the south but have had zero issues in the northwest -- everyone is super mellow.
They like you just fine. You're not like "them". You're not like the racist, bigoted, regressive, backwards, ignorant, inbreds of people who still live in the South. Most people out here can comprehend the concept that there are people in our country who conservative, religious, and smart. They'd shit themselves if they met someone who was conservative and smarter than they were. (This is where you insert a joke abou…
You don't deserve the downvotes.
I grew up in Seattle and still live there. If you voice any opinions that are not in a narrow band of the far left wing, they (including recent transplants) will attribute you holding that opinion to your place of origin, rather than listening to any justification you have for holding that opinion.
Re: Classism in America
#200Earlier quoted context omitted.
Sure, but I'd wager that the rural folk would be fine if all the city dwellers disappeared, and that the opposite is not true.
Food wise maybe. But do you think your medicine, qualified doctors, medical equipment, internet, computers you use, movies and tv series you watch, trucks you drive and tons of other things besides grow on trees? (Not to mention farming subsidies)
Those things are all related to quality of life vs. life itself.