91–100 of 107 posts
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Is it really that hard? The templates on http://wrapbootstrap.com/ are fairly varied and don't tend to be obviously bootstrappy.
But grabbing a template from a website isn't "working with a designer." Foundation still blows Bootstrap away in terms of building a truly bespoke site on top of their components.
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Have you tried talking them into the current century and all of its spoils?
Heh, sure have :) Problem is most (European, e.g. less donation-financed) non-profits have a cash flow fundamentally different to that of a company: Most of the budget comes from a foundation, the government etc. and is tied to a specific use . So if the non-profit got funds for a specific project, they have e.g. full wages for 3 persons, much money for train tickets/renting of cars, food and accomodation, renting of…
The key unanswered question, and for me the fundamental reason I switched from using Bootstrap to Foundation at work, is how designer friendly the two are. Bootstrap is fantastic when you want a site that looks like Bootstrap, these tend to be put together by developers. Foundation (at least was) much less opinionated and therefore when you're given a PSD by a designer much easier to implement. Have things improved o…
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I don't find this to be the case. There are a ton of conventions in Bootstrap, an obvious one being its variables, that are very useful when working in a team, and (in our experience) with outside contractors. I couldn't imagine giving up Bootstrap simply 'because flexbox'. Also flexbox support in IE is still terrible, so for those of us building sites for the open-web it's a non-starter for things where a 'just does…
By variables do you just mean the CSS pre-processors? My reason for asking is that it's not unique to Bootstrap at all (and, if they just use the default build, many designers will never even see them).
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Nobody should be using Photoshop nowadays to design a website. A competent web designer knows about html and css and - most importantly - has a good understanding for how a website behaves, especially regarding responsiveness and animations. It is a good reason to leave the room / team / project when "design a website" means "open photoshop".
So, I'm not a web designer or developer (anymore). But.. This strikes me as being the same line of though as "Leave the team when your new coding project starts with a whiteboard rather than text editor". Sure, we can just start coding, but the result is rarely as clean.
It does nothing to help their consistency, since you cannot define common styles to be reused.
And it has a trickle-down effect, where any developer working with the files now needs a license to open the document.
I would like to see a comparison of BS4 with Semantic UI, it has a few pretty interesting components
Yes Semantic UI has come a long way and changed since I first used them 1-2 years ago. I have just tried it on a new project their annoying build process and lack of official SASS support the style and out of box components are really great.
I have had some experience with semantic UI components recently and I enjoyed using it.
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"Culturally insensitive" wasn't part of the discussion. He listed specific technical and UX issues with their approach. Another commenter in this thread posted a link to the github discussion.
Having re-read the thread, I stand by my "in-a-nutshell" summary of it. I don't think any of his technical arguments hold up. I'm also not sure that he would have convinced the Bootstrap team to have dropped this based on technical arguments if he hadn't seemed so annoyed, and made repeated references to how only people who speak the language should make certain decisions. Some examples: * the bug report is a command…
There's no shortage of insufferably squeaky wheels who aren't acquiesced to, and I don't see any ways this one was treated exceptionally. It looks like the maintainers worked to understand the root of his frustration despite his abrasive style. Kudos. The Bootstrap team acknowledging it's a complex issue (rather than the solved problem they thought it to be) and changing their release plan accordingly seems a reasonable way to handle it, and one I'd encourage for maintainers of widely used projects. Finding the right effort/quality balance is tricky. That some of the issues could be relatively trivial to address (font stack) doesn't invalidate the category.
In particular, the distinction between RTL and “flipping” does seem to be a meaningful one, and fraught with unexpected issues. Eg, next=right and prev=left as a cultural convention that doesn't directly translate. As you note.
Frankly, if tasked with supporting RTL I'd probably start with a repo like the one you linked to, but fully expect it to fall down in a number of ways that could only be identified by a native user. Whether those issues get addressed would be a pretty clear statement on how much those users are valued.
PS upvoted for pleasant discussion :)
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Having re-read the thread, I stand by my "in-a-nutshell" summary of it. I don't think any of his technical arguments hold up. I'm also not sure that he would have convinced the Bootstrap team to have dropped this based on technical arguments if he hadn't seemed so annoyed, and made repeated references to how only people who speak the language should make certain decisions. Some examples: * the bug report is a command…
Agreed that it wasn't raised very diplomatically. That's part personality/choice, part what happens when English isn't someone's first language. Comes with the localization territory. That he produced a coded alternative, regardless of its merits, puts him in good faith in my book. There's no shortage of insufferably squeaky wheels who aren't acquiesced to, and I don't see any ways this one was treated exceptionally.…
This appeared to be the crux of the original complaint/misunderstanding too. The assumption that the core BS devs would auto-flip and leave it at that. But all but the most basic of rtl-flippers allow for case by case overrides to add the final 5% that the simple rules can't handle. Finding and fixing those requires people with an understanding of RTL and Bootstrap could easily have recruited that effort. It's just that they only have to do the last 1/20th of the work, and even without expert input devs building on top of Bootsrap can automatically get 95% for free on any extensions they build themselves.
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I don't find this to be the case. There are a ton of conventions in Bootstrap, an obvious one being its variables, that are very useful when working in a team, and (in our experience) with outside contractors. I couldn't imagine giving up Bootstrap simply 'because flexbox'. Also flexbox support in IE is still terrible, so for those of us building sites for the open-web it's a non-starter for things where a 'just does…
I disagree. Flexbox is a little buggy in IE11(and IE10 with auto-preifxer and the old spec) for almost everything it's fine, you just need to remember to set widths on column layouts, which is just one extra line. Not to say it isn't frustrating, especially since it works extremely well in Edge but MS said they won't port the fixes over.
For contrast if you work against a framework like Bootstrap 3, sites 'just work' all the way back to IE8.