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Business School is a Joke

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Re: Business School is a Joke

#31

Post by coryl »

I would largely agree that a business education doesn't prepare you for entrepreneurship. But it isn't exactly valueless. Here's some of the courses and concepts I liked about MY business education:

- Case studies: in accounting/biz analysis class, we learned by studying fictional and real case studies, from jewelery startups started by 2 former students to mid-sized soda manufacturing companies. You get a background about the founders, some key market factors, relevant prices and financial figures, etc. You then come up with your own conclusions and rationalize why, and present your findings under a Socratic teaching environment.

Strategy course + game simulation: The strategy game was a lot of fun, you get together with your group and try to take over the shoe business by building factories in 4 continents, setting prices, budgets, R&D, etc. It also based its currencies against real world currencies. Every week, you got your results and tried to out-compete other groups.

Operations: My ops prof worked in consulting and bragged to clients that if he couldn't find a way to save you money in 20 mins, he'd consult for free. He dives straight into the books and starts crossing out inventory. Why? Inventory takes storage space, heat, security, insurance. Ops is largely inapplicable to web startups because it deals with tangibles. But I still liked learning about it.

I would say business schools aren't really for the hacker/entrepreneur mindset. They are generally for people who want careers in management.

Re: Business School is a Joke

#32

Post by iamwil »

JohnnyBrown wrote: post #26

Do programmers/engineers have an inferiority complex vs. Management/MBA types? I don't see many articles on HN bashing sales professions advising youngsters not to go to trade school . . .

Probably not. There have just been lots of bad MBAs in the last couple years that make clueless business decisions, and we've probably suffered under the hands of one at one time or another. Like asking to measure productivity in the number of lines of code. Sure, it might seem like it makes sense, but it'll soon be apparent it doesn't if you've tried to code at all, even just a little bit.

Having a business sense is great. But when you get MBAs that think that's all there is, it makes for bad business decisions that engineers have suffered under. Having some grasp of the actual nature of the business that you're in will go a long way.

Re: Business School is a Joke

#33

Post by iamwil »

coryl wrote: post #31

I would largely agree that a business education doesn't prepare you for entrepreneurship. But it isn't exactly valueless. Here's some of the courses and concepts I liked about MY business education: - Case studies: in accounting/biz analysis class, we learned by studying fictional and real case studies, from jewelery startups started by 2 former students to mid-sized soda manufacturing companies. You get a background…

I hope he thinks about the implications to each business he consults before he starts crossing inventory out willy-nilly. Most of the time, it might make sense, and certainly, it's good to question whether you need it.

But just doing so to optimize solely on cost might be a local maxima. You might impact other less tangible aspects/dimensions/parameters of the business in a negative way, and usually other people have to suffer at the hands of MBA's decisions.

Re: Business School is a Joke

#34

Post by fhirzall »

mr_november wrote: post #14

I feel the HN title is a touch misleading - when I hear B-school, I think MBA, maybe that's just me. The fact that this is undergrad is significant. In my opinion, thought leaders, both from the external 'business' world as well as top professors, often feel it is a waste of their time teaching undergrads, many of whom are there because it is what one is supposed to do (ie. go out and get an education) rather than be…

Long time lurker here =).

Agreed, I'm doing an M.S now (non-business) and I've always been under the impression that the MBA crowd is a little bit older - not too old, but people that have had a few years of experience in an industry. Don't quote me on this but don't most Ivy MBA programs require 3-5 years of actual work experience for acceptance?

I also have a few friends doing MBAs and most of what they do involves case studies of real companies and problems that they faced.

-- Not advocating everyone go out there and get an MBA, but the title should mention that it's undergrad business school.

Re: Business School is a Joke

#35

Post by jey »

mr_november wrote: post #14

I feel the HN title is a touch misleading - when I hear B-school, I think MBA, maybe that's just me. The fact that this is undergrad is significant. In my opinion, thought leaders, both from the external 'business' world as well as top professors, often feel it is a waste of their time teaching undergrads, many of whom are there because it is what one is supposed to do (ie. go out and get an education) rather than be…

Are you implying that an MBA isn't a joke?

Re: Business School is a Joke

#36

Post by elai »

zaidf wrote: post #19

I have been on both sides of this feeling. In my freshman and sophomore year, I believed school was crap. Here are the feelings and attitudes I had: 1. school can't teach me much 2. I already know so much 3. Gosh why am I here? 4. Am I ever going to use this? I was so turned off by the busi100 classes that I gave up even applying for business. Instead, I chose the easiest major on campus(communications) in hopes that…

I think it's more learning things that you have had no need for, so you wont use it to learn it. I think co-ops should start very early in people's university careers so they can see what they need in their educations.

Re: Business School is a Joke

#37

Post by robryan »

zaidf wrote: post #19

I have been on both sides of this feeling. In my freshman and sophomore year, I believed school was crap. Here are the feelings and attitudes I had: 1. school can't teach me much 2. I already know so much 3. Gosh why am I here? 4. Am I ever going to use this? I was so turned off by the busi100 classes that I gave up even applying for business. Instead, I chose the easiest major on campus(communications) in hopes that…

I would say the same, a lot of the uni I've done, especially the straight computer science stuff has been basic looks which I picked up before I took the classes online.

There are though benefits in that these classes kind of force you to take a slower and more in depth look at some things and you end up learning the area better. I know with my operating systems class, I already knew a lot of the basics about how it all worked, but taking the focus to learn it well taught be quiet a bit I think.

Re: Business School is a Joke

#38

Post by dtegart »

jraines wrote: post #10
gkoberger wrote: post #9

I have always thought business school would be a lot better off if people were forced to read people like Seth Godin or even Chris Anderson. My problem with business people is that they learn buzz words and jargon, and often treat the "makers" as tools. I would have a lot more respect for b-school if business majors were forced to pick a "concentration"- engineering, CS, etc. They wouldn't be expected to be great at…

I don't think anyone is going to be cured of buzzworditis by being forced to read Godin and Anderson. Can I interest you in my biz, which is a freemium play on a purple cow concept? We just need enough money to get through The Dip.

That is true. Also any specialized profession is going to have jargon just because it makes it easier to discuss things.

Re: Business School is a Joke

#39

Post by coryl »

iamwil wrote: post #33
coryl wrote: post #31

I would largely agree that a business education doesn't prepare you for entrepreneurship. But it isn't exactly valueless. Here's some of the courses and concepts I liked about MY business education: - Case studies: in accounting/biz analysis class, we learned by studying fictional and real case studies, from jewelery startups started by 2 former students to mid-sized soda manufacturing companies. You get a background…

I hope he thinks about the implications to each business he consults before he starts crossing inventory out willy-nilly. Most of the time, it might make sense, and certainly, it's good to question whether you need it. But just doing so to optimize solely on cost might be a local maxima. You might impact other less tangible aspects/dimensions/parameters of the business in a negative way, and usually other people have…

I'm sure he considers the impact of the decisions along with the clients he works for.

You are right that other less tangible aspects can be impacted in unforeseen ways. But that has nothing to do with the decisions of business people or MBA's. It has to do with leadership and corporate culture.

Re: Business School is a Joke

#40

Post by silverlake »

On the MBA, a few friends w/ science backgrounds said they cruised through top 10 b-schools without much effort. They did it only to transition from science to business careers quickly. Their advice was to skim an intro finance & marketing book. The rest was crap.
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